This is an attempt on my part to collect as many suggestions and tips as people have for beating good hammerdins with a melee (ww or kick) assassin. I'm talking the kind of hammer pally whose hammers usually one hit kill, or at least cause massive damage. I'm also talking the kind that use enigma and can tele well but also use charge more than anything to get around. Finally, I'm talking the high life (CTA) and high defense variant that knows how to pump up defense vs. melee opponents.

SO....
You can't stun them effectively as they can charge right out of it. You can't easily DF or tele to them w/o taking a hit. The pally will charge all around your general area dropping hammers which you run into w/o even seeing them. You have to actually HIT them to deliver OW.

What do people do for these guys? I find this my hardest duel by far. Much harder than necros or any other class.

This is an attempt on my part to collect as many suggestions and tips as people have for beating good hammerdins with a melee (ww or kick) assassin. I'm talking the kind of hammer pally whose hammers usually one hit kill, or at least cause massive damage. I'm also talking the kind that use enigma and can tele well but also use charge more than anything to get around. Finally, I'm talking the high life (CTA) and high defense variant that knows how to pump up defense vs. melee opponents.

SO....
You can't stun them effectively as they can charge right out of it. You can't easily DF or tele to them w/o taking a hit. The pally will charge all around your general area dropping hammers which you run into w/o even seeing them. You have to actually HIT them to deliver OW.

What do people do for these guys? I find this my hardest duel by far. Much harder than necros or any other class.
Why do you think this is the exact Pally build I have? Lol. I just find GOOD sorces and SOME necs hard to deal with.

Anyways, Speed, I have the exact same problem, and not just w/ the GOOD ones with the majority of the hammerdins. What I find works... kinda of. Is just namelock w/ MB and dont let them get near. When they Tele/Charge out of the MB (they WILL close in on you) the WW away, hopefully he clicked on you w/ charge so he will follow right into the WW. Then pray for OW.

tea|th-']Why do you think this is the exact Pally build I have? Lol. I just find GOOD sorces and SOME necs hard to deal with.

Anyways, Speed, I have the exact same problem, and not just w/ the GOOD ones with the majority of the hammerdins. What I find works... kinda of. Is just namelock w/ MB and dont let them get near. When they Tele/Charge out of the MB (they WILL close in on you) the WW away, hopefully he clicked on you w/ charge so he will follow right into the WW. Then pray for OW.

I've been having some luck with the MB bit myself. Level 42 mindblast at 105 fast cast does do some damage. I wonder...how would the 174 breakpoint do in this situation? Something perhaps to play with a little.

tea|th-']Why do you think this is the exact Pally build I have? Lol. I just find GOOD sorces and SOME necs hard to deal with.

Anyways, Speed, I have the exact same problem, and not just w/ the GOOD ones with the majority of the hammerdins. What I find works... kinda of. Is just namelock w/ MB and dont let them get near. When they Tele/Charge out of the MB (they WILL close in on you) the WW away, hopefully he clicked on you w/ charge so he will follow right into the WW. Then pray for OW.

You on west non-ladder? If so, want to bring that pally to a game sometime to see if there's a way to beat him?

You on west non-ladder? If so, want to bring that pally to a game sometime to see if there's a way to beat him?
If I had him on West N/L. My current chars are on East Ladder (I have 2 of them on over all ladder woot!) But all I have left on West is my first WWsin Build (She is a good pub dueler thats it) and a 91 zon. Other chars expired. =(
However, if bnet will stop giving me realm down I'll test on my own. I have my current Sin and my pally, and 2 comps/cdkeys and a little brother who plays as well. So hopefully I'll be able to get back on soon and I'll get my brother up here to duel me until I find a way to own him. Then I'll post here. Wish me luck!

j;fhsajalsd @ Blizzard for giving me realm down since we use mulitple chars on 1 connection. Damn them!

I have a trapper/WWer, but I usually use WoF and MB, and he usually charges right at you and tele's. When hes right under you, just WW a bit south and stay there. Make him move again, and short WW south again. I try to stay in the little pocket right under him, and force him to move to kill me. Meanwhile I have WoF/MB and Fireblasts, while, generally pretty weak, does wittle away at his life.

I have a trapper/WWer, but I usually use WoF and MB, and he usually charges right at you and tele's. When hes right under you, just WW a bit south and stay there. Make him move again, and short WW south again. I try to stay in the little pocket right under him, and force him to move to kill me. Meanwhile I have WoF/MB and Fireblasts, while, generally pretty weak, does wittle away at his life.
Yeah I have been playing w/ my brother (he was on my ever so godly pally) and I find that you have to make him play offensively. Because you can not auto-target - you can use this to your advantage. Make him tele to you then just WW away. That is what I have foudn to work the best. The only time I still won tho was when I managed to block several hammers (Thank gor for 60% WB). He just had too much life.

a defensive hammerdin would be very hard for a melee asn to kill

isn't there something about how if you sit in a corner hammers can't hit you? This is probably considered "Cheap" but sit in the corner and use blade fury... hey it could work =)

I've had best luck being on the defensive. Cast cloak to begin with--it doesn't do much, but every little bit helps. If they're standing in a hammer field, namelock and use blade fury. Once they warp to you make a short ww downward. Rinse and repeat. Slowly you'll whittle their life down. A riskier gambit is to lay wof traps around you. Mindblast him as soon as he teles on you, then make short wws back and forth. Hopefully you'll kill him before he makes it out of stunlock.

I've only had real problems with ones that charge around a bunch because I get desynced. Your best hope is to know that once he stops charging and starts laying hammers, even though it looks like he's across the screen he's right on top of you! Make a short ww downward, then namelock with blade fury again. Repeat the process until he's dead.

Hammers are harder to dodge than I once thought. I only tinkered with it for a few minutes against my friend's hammerdin, and I was destroyed ever time I didn't pay attention. MB/WoF was the only thing I could do to him, even when he wasn't trying. Then all I could do with the kicker (no WW, sadly) was try to get under him and release a round of kicks.

No help against experts, though, sorry. :)

Hammers are harder to dodge than I once thought. I only tinkered with it for a few minutes against my friend's hammerdin, and I was destroyed ever time I didn't pay attention. MB/WoF was the only thing I could do to him, even when he wasn't trying. Then all I could do with the kicker (no WW, sadly) was try to get under him and release a round of kicks.

No help against experts, though, sorry. :)
They are tough, granted. Just a random thought, have a Widowmaker on switch... hammerdins are not very good verse range. Just stay away from him and shoot GAs at him, he will eventually come at you, switch back to claws and WW away. You have to get him to come to you, and take advantage of every gap he gives you and the hammers. You also need to make sure your WB is at 60% no lower or you are screwed.

I just watched koda duel another Hammerdin I think from Evo :scratch: , or one of his buddies. And it seems like they were both dueling pretty hard, they were pretty evenly matched but once Koda got a good WW on him he mb'ed him to death, by that time koda had half life if I remeber.
I don't think many WWsins could beat him, koda's was a hybrid of sorts so...
I think he made the pally go offensive and was leading him and locking him with traps. Very cool duel to watch.

From my experience, if you rely on a melee attack to do all of your damage, then you will lose to a good pally about 90% of the time.

You definately need some sort of method to make the pally go offensive to start off with, and on top of that, you always have to stay south of him, or he'll smack you silly.

I just watched koda duel another Hammerdin I think from Evo :scratch: , or one of his buddies. And it seems like they were both dueling pretty hard, they were pretty evenly matched but once Koda got a good WW on him he mb'ed him to death, by that time koda had half life if I remeber.
I don't think many WWsins could beat him, koda's was a hybrid of sorts so...
I think he made the pally go offensive and was leading him and locking him with traps. Very cool duel to watch.
What do you mean Kod'as was a hybrid of sorts?

Hammer Pallies and Wind Druids have been a thorn in my side. I experimented with using widowmaker, but OW is nerfed for ranged so it's hard to do a lot of dmg. Additionally, any pally with some common sense will charge when the bow comes out. Windies are mostly hard because they have soooo much life and when they use wolves the minions are stacked so deep.

I'm about ready to say screw it and build a hybrid bone/poison necs. I love spirits and should be able to pull 5k nova (before trangs) along with 3k spirit and 500 dmg teeth. I know some prefer spear, but I love spirit, you just need to know how to use the slow speed to your advantage.

My smiter uses widdow maker against them, I suppose you could use blade fury at them until they start to walk then dflight. Wash rinse repeat. If you get the chanse dtalon em.

stack up that OW, use widow/blade fury

speed, u still owe me a duel ;)

*souless-pvp

It will be hard to hit a hammerdin with BF. As for widowmaker, it takes a long time to chisel down their 3+K of life, particularly since 1 or 2 hammers = death. I'm not saying hammerdins are impossible, but the good ones are can be pretty close. Same with windies. Thankfully there aren't very many good hammerdins and windies out there because skillful players tend to persue challenge and fun instead of overpowered builds. As for a strategy that can be applied versus good hammerdins and windies there isn't much that can be said other than the key to winning is masterful use of wof/MB and cunning avoidance of attacks. Having a high dmg dragon flight is very valuable.

My next kicker will have a bit of speedlander in it though. Max shadow master, dragon talon, dragon flight and MB.

A good WW assassin should destroy most windies. Stunlock with traps and then WW. Hammerdins are harder but you should use basically the same strategy.

Cast WoF, MB and an evil shadow to its side, let her do the hard job (of dying). I do like this and only go into kick scene when hes like runing away (of her) so isnt casting hammers.

Windruids are easier IMO, WoF and MB kills the minions. The only ones I cant stand are the Doom users.