View Full Version : Uh oh, turn off your Maphack NOW kiddies!
ConnerMacleod
06-08-2004, 10:49
http://www.battle.net/
http://www.battle.net/
http://www.battle.net/
http://www.battle.net/
It's only a matter of time before they do the same for Diablo 2.
:clap: :clap: :clap:
If a matter of time = 2 years, then yes, i agree ;p
EtherealSoul
06-08-2004, 10:54
Practice what you preach.
Relativity
06-08-2004, 10:56
I think you're being a little too generous with 2 years cougar. :)
yeah, i forgot to add the "0"
ConnerMacleod
06-08-2004, 10:59
I'm gonna say next week for D2. It would be unfair of them to ban W3 during this ladder race and not ban D2. I actually found this out on GFraizer's personal webpage, where he linked to it just a little while ago. That GF, he so crazy!
EtherealSoul
06-08-2004, 11:01
We all know that Blizzard is partial to their top 16'ers. The ones that deserve the ban wont get it.. We will end up having a trigger pk in top 16 getting immortalized probably. Nice representation of HC.
stevethatsmyname
06-08-2004, 11:04
they routinely ban for Maphack on warcraft 3 but have never banned for maphack on diablo2 iirc. Maphack on WC3 is the equivalent of botting on diablo2 as far as blizzard is concerned.
MoUsE_WiZ
06-08-2004, 11:05
WC3 accounts have been closed before with no bannings.
Not to mention that if there are bannings, they won't be for MH.
The thing is, WC3 players can't hide the evidence shown in replays, not to mention Blizzard can (don't know if they do, but they can) monitor random ladder games without anyone knowing. It's too bad we can't save replays of baal runs =D
_OrpheusPrime_
06-08-2004, 11:08
Anyone else think blizz gives a f.. rip? about D2 anymore? I really just lost faith entirely.
Whome shell we play with in the pubies than :(
:D
ConnerMacleod
06-08-2004, 11:13
Forgive me, I know ZERO about WC3. They have the ability to record gameplay or something? Oh how cool is that!? And I don't see how botting in D2 is the equivalent of Maphack in WC3 in Blizz's eyes. Me confused, does the Maphack for WC3 take up bandwidth or am I off point? :scratch:
EtherealSoul
06-08-2004, 11:15
Starcraft and WC 2 i think and above had the ability to save the entire game, and all the actions going on. If this was placed in a d2 game, you coudl easily use it to prove TPPK and stuff.
Yeah, you can replay games. Play them and watch them later. It's a kewl feature, but it sucks in a way. Pretty much ruined all the good builds in Starcraft because everyone just copied all the pro's down to the tee.
You aren't really saving the game persay. The computer plays the game back exactly the way you played it via a replay. I don't know the exact logistics of it, but that's the basic jist.
MoUsE_WiZ
06-08-2004, 11:28
You're saving the actions the game goes through rather than a video of the game, then those actions are played back. (Just to repost what cougar just said for no good reason). I don't think the same technology could be used in D2 since the game is client/server, the server would be having to record every single action that every player/AI/object went through in every game and store that record until the game went down or something to that extent. Either that or it would have to send all the information to every client continously, and so far as I'm concerned we already have enough hacks based on the server sending information back. Either way, good luck with that happening, I don't think Blizzard much appreciate what bandwidth we already use.
It did not ruin good builds in SC, replays are relatively (speaking in patch # terms) new, people already copied all the builds, and the game was already entirely about how well you can micro/scout/theorycraft long before 1.08 (or was it 1.09?).
Yeah, to some extent. But it did somewhat bastardize it in a way. Because new players would just watch rep's of the pro's and copy them. Wouldn't actually go out and play for themselves and figure it out on their own. I'd be in a game using a build that i'd messed with for a couple years, and some newer player would come in there and tell me who i was copying or whatever. Kind of got annoying.
But yeah, it is all about micro and scouting and the ability to adapt in game.
Replays were 1.08, you were right.
[QUOTE=ConnerMacleod]Uh oh, turn off your Maphack NOW kiddies!
QUOTE]
I AM NOT A KID!! :lol:
[QUOTE=ConnerMacleod]http://www.battle.net/
It's only a matter of time before they do the same for Diablo 2.
Didnt you say this last ladder season and guess what it didnt happen.
stevethatsmyname
06-08-2004, 13:46
the analogy that i drew about maphack:WC3::Botting: Diablo2 may not make complete sense, but this is how i understand it:
Warcraft 3 is a competitive game. The point of the game (at least in ladder mode) is to defeat your opponent. You are awarded experience for winning a game.
I have fought against opponents using maphack. If they have any skill whatsoever, it is nearly impossible to win. Period. They know exactly where all your troops are at all times. They know what you are building, where you are going. If you are out creeping (leveling your hero) they can easily slip into your base and pretty much take you out. That is not to say that a non-maphacking player isn't able to do this, but it is 10x easier when you know exactly where the enemy base is (no annoying scouting) and exactly when their army is the furthest from the base. Maphack wins games. Thus, legit people LOSE games becasue of maphack. Other players maphacking cause legit players to lose out, and so the legit players will be more upset over this.
Diablo 2 is more of a cooperative or solo game... not quite as much competition. When one person has an advantage over another, the others tend not to be as vociferous as if they were actually LOSING something because of it. Legit players have the option of just ignoring the maphackers, and doing their own thing. I would say that the majority of battle.net, including the legit crowd (but perhaps a minority of those people on this forum) either a) use maphack, or b) accept the use of maphack as 'not harming anyone'. There is not as much of a general public outcry against it.
But botting is kind of different. There is competition going on out here, but a different type of competition. Who can pimp out their character best.... who has the best dueler, who can get the richest the fastest, who gets to the top of the ladder first. And botters win this one hands-down. There is no way to get better items than a botter unless you have no life except meph runs.
TheCerberus
06-08-2004, 16:32
Well I'm just surprised they actually permabanned somekeys. 1400 right?
Now I lay me down to sleep,
I pray for the soul of the D2 game to keep,
If Blizzard bans 1400 keys before I wake,
I'll throw a party and bake a cake.
CreLuSioN
06-08-2004, 16:45
lol wc is there new serie u really think they will do the same for d2...
Elu's Might
06-08-2004, 17:46
In keeping with our aggresive stance against cheating
2 months. *cough*
-Where have I heard this before?
I myself would have to agree with Conner on this one, except, it doesnt matter if you turn off your Maphack now, its too late. And actually the last big ban did follow a WC3 ban by about a week if I remember correctly, so the timing might be right on too. If only they will plug the TPPK holes, that would make me happier. Also I hope if they ban that charachters associated with the ban get greyed out or removed from the ladder.
PS I hope they do a complete ban. Get them all. Chickeners, MHers, TPPK, Botters. Get the whole bunch of them. Lets put everyone back on a level playing field (wishful thinking, but hey, Im an optimist).
ConnerMacleod
06-08-2004, 19:16
Yeah, it is too late! Muahahahaha. JDM, I said it last season, but I'm an optimist! Character flaw. No matter what I may say, I will always have a shred of hope.
Blizzard only cares about a game while it is their number 1 cash cow. When wc3 came out all the focus went there, and when WoW comes out the same thing will happen. The goal then is to get their games asap and play them until their next one comes out ;)
xeyloderixed
06-08-2004, 23:36
Now I lay me down to sleep,
I pray for the soul of the D2 game to keep,
If Blizzard bans 1400 keys before I wake,
I'll throw a party and bake a cake.
can i have some?
laughingtiger
06-08-2004, 23:52
can i have some?
Pssst... I think the operative word in that poem there is "bake". :lol:
Now I lay me down to sleep,
I pray for the soul of the D2 game to keep,
If Blizzard bans 1400 keys before I wake,
I'll throw a party and bake a cake.
*Wipes a tear from his eye*
That was freakin' beautiful man...
originally posted by stevethatsmyname
But botting is kind of different. There is competition going on out here, but a different type of competition. Who can pimp out their character best.... who has the best dueler, who can get the richest the fastest, who gets to the top of the ladder first. And botters win this one hands-down. There is no way to get better items than a botter unless you have no life except meph runs.
I have to disagree with you on this point. I run almost daily with the vast majority of the top 16 on HCL west. I know them well and can say without doubt that they do not bot. I can see the friends list function spam constant green messages from them going into manual MF games because they instantly reply to me whenever I whisper to them.
Botting ruins the game, I totally agree there. It makes the ratio of rune to non-rune item value ratio rediculous devaluing the majority of non-runes items. However, to imply that the top 16 got there by botting is a false statement.
Getting to the top takes teamwork; there is nothing else more important than that.
ConnerMacleod
07-08-2004, 20:23
Pssst... I think the operative word in that poem there is "bake". :lol:
LOL, I'll throw a party and then get baked!
LuckyDwarf
07-08-2004, 20:45
Now I lay me down to sleep,
I pray for the soul of the D2 game to keep,
If Blizzard bans 1400 keys before I wake,
I'll throw a party and bake a cake.
Enter Hackman.
Lucky
laughingtiger
07-08-2004, 21:07
LOL, I'll throw a party and then get baked!
Enter Cheech & Chong... :innocent:
can i have some?
Only if your good....
*thwaps Xey's hand with wooden spoon*
....and stay outta the batter.
The goal then is to get their games asap and play them until their next one comes out ;)
Then their evil plan has worked....
Replays were 1.08, you were right.
Yeah, but don't you think the cheese builds "ruined" the game way more than the replays? For a while, there wasn't anything but 2 or 3 builds out there, and any fool could copy those even without a vid playback. Besides, it's not like copying other players is necessary, you can also get some pretty good ideas playing vs the comp in some maps. As far as botting comparisons go, I think there were some scripts for WC3 that were worse than maphacks....
save the entire game, and all the actions going on. If this was placed in a d2 game, you coudl easily use it to prove TPPK and stuff.
And this would prompt Blizz to do what, exactly? See first quote...
HelzCaretaker
10-08-2004, 10:41
Heres the thing, maphack ruined dueling way back in .09 and continues to do so until this day. Basically I will admit to using mh way back in .09 and yes it does make a huge difference pvm which allows your hc character to be a lot safer and to do runs faster. PvP mh did nothing until 2 things came out, a) item scan, this allowed any idiot with mh to see how a real duelers gear was, basically before maphack 1/2 of the serious duelers knew the appropriate gear to use and 1/20th or so that were semi duelers knew the gear. Once people could scan you they can copy your builds and tada your build is out. B) Once chicken came along with mh 95% of the duelers turned it on so they don't die, last time I checked HC was about dying. Playing hc with chicken is like lite beer, sure its still beer but it just isn't the same (btw I hate lite/light beer).
Cheating is cheating no matter how you look at it and I will go to say that yes some cheating can do less damage then others, but even seeing the map in diablo or wc or w/e game you play when you're not supposed to is wrong as well as getting countless items for free.
And btw recording real time strategy games has been out for a while I remember way back in the day when I played age of empires 2, they had a record game feature and it had many options. You can follow any player on the board (see their resources and where they are), follow their screen, follow it with being able to see full map or not, with fog of war or without. Basically this was there so players could see where they went wrong, what they did right, and how to improve on the game. Even when I d/l the pro games there was no way I could play like they did.
end rant :wave:
Playing hc with chicken is like lite beer, sure its still beer but it just isn't the same
I think your analogy is wrong.
Playing SC is like drinking lite beer. Playing HC with chicken/MH enabled is like drinking someone elses day-old barf.
ConnerMacleod
11-08-2004, 08:51
Pure poetry, kurg. Poetry I tells ya.
MachineOfaDream
11-08-2004, 11:03
A few comments I've made before:
1. People at the top of the ladder have no need for bots. When you run 100+ baals per day, you end up with a lot of good items no matter what.
2. I think it'd be better to find a fix to the MH if they can, or simply find a way to RD you if it's detected... The problem with banning people is that there are plenty of people out there who don't use MH but still benefit from it a lot. I'm pretty sure I'd be #1 on the east if all the MHers were banned, (I'm #6 now) but I am also pretty sure that I wouldn't be the level I am without having had MH tele sorcs in my runs. I never ask them if they use it, and I'm not an expert at teleing cause I don't like to play sorc, but I'm pretty sure they all use it... Anyway, I don't think it'd be fair to give someone like me a leg up on the whole realm just because I was only using MH passively. I also never thought it was fair to make me have to strictly police the people who I play with. So not fair to ban me either, is it? If I just play the game and let others do as they please, no reason to ban me. But if they get banned I should be banned just being sadly aware of how they do what they do? It's tough. I'd MUCH RATHER if they could possibly find a way to just make it so MH screws you and gives you RD....
MachineOfaDream
11-08-2004, 11:09
..........
MoUsE_WiZ
11-08-2004, 12:53
A few comments I've made before:
1. People at the top of the ladder have no need for bots. When you run 100+ baals per day, you end up with a lot of good items no matter what.
That doesn't change the fact that some of them do or did bot.
CreLuSioN
11-08-2004, 13:40
+ u dont end up with good items if u only do baal cause killing baal is slow and u never get anything cause all the others use pickit and if something good drops from minions some1 with pickit got it before u even see it drop so tell me how u get good items from doing baal runs ?
MoUsE_WiZ
11-08-2004, 14:08
Because
1) Telesorc gets baal drops in priv runs
2) Pickit=banned from runs
All the top players play privates whereever possible.
CreLuSioN
11-08-2004, 14:44
thought we were talking bout pubbys
Whome shell we play with in the pubies than :(
See, I always take care of business by working the handle, I don't play in or with the bush...
-Lum
+ u dont end up with good items if u only do baal cause killing baal is slow and u never get anything cause all the others use pickit and if something good drops from minions some1 with pickit got it before u even see it drop so tell me how u get good items from doing baal runs ?
Ya know, i've been hearing people talk about pickit for awhile, but in the Baal runs i've been doing I pretty much get everything cause of a fast pc and a fast i-net connection. I haven't experienced pickit at all =/
MachineOfaDream
12-08-2004, 00:12
+ u dont end up with good items if u only do baal cause killing baal is slow and u never get anything cause all the others use pickit and if something good drops from minions some1 with pickit got it before u even see it drop so tell me how u get good items from doing baal runs ?
I'm talking about the players who lead the ladder. I'm saying that botting isn't an advantage to them. I'm not talking about people who do pubs. No one who's doing pubs is leading any ladder. You could count on one hand the number of top 100 players who got most of their exp in pub runs... The people who win the ladders typically run their own baals and item drops are always monitored. Most runs give the teler first dibs but evrryone ends up with some nice stuff after a while. Sorry if you didn't know about this already; I just assumed... We're talking 100+ baal runs per day, too. Per day.
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