Can someone give me a link to claw speed tables?

[jam3s.]

Hello. I am a dual claw trapper, so i was wondering if it mattered which claw i equipped first or which claw was in which hand?

one of them is a suwayyah, the other one is scissors katar..

so to lay my traps the quickest, how should i be holding my claws?

also, can anyone link me to the claw speed table?

[Naliworld]

Use the WSM of the claw you equip first, or the one that is left when you unequip one claw(you should be equipping the Scissors Katar first, to take advantage of its faster WSM). Use the table heading "%IAS required for 7 frame attack with Claw/Shield Non-Elemental Chargeup Attack" on this page (http://www.diabloii.net/characters/assassin/ias.shtml)(which you can reach by clicking on the drop-down menu labelled DiabloII.Net links, located on the top-left hand corner of this page, and selecting the link labelled C/S & C/C IAS Sheet).

So, you'd need 37% additional IAS to reach the cap of 7 frames when casting Traps, with an slvl 5 BoS(if you equip the Scissors Katar first).

[brianc84]

Trap laying speed is not the same as normal attack speed.

Scissors Katar on the screen right first then the Suwayyah on the screen left should give you a ~-15 equivalent WSM and therefore start you off at 13 fpa.

You'd need 46 more EIAS+SkillIAS to reach the 9 frame cap. You'd be able to do this with level 3 BoS and 20 IAS.

[BIGeyedBUG]

brianc84 knows 100x more than me about weapon speed but it's probably worth noting that his plan will only result in that speed until you weaponswitch or retrieve your body. After that you'd have to reequip your weapons in the same order to get that WSM.

If you equip the scissors katar first and screen-left, and the suwayyah screen-right it's going to be slower, but you don't have to worry about your weapons resetting. I get this table:

Skill Trap placing
WIAS [right weapon] 0 %
WIAS [left weapon] 0 %
IAS Frames per attack
0 % 15
4 % 14
11 % 13
23 % 12
39 % 11
63 % 10
105 % 9

I'm almost sure any IAS has to be either on the scissors katar or off-weapon to contribute to this. Also if you're using BoS, the table would be completely different.

[Nali--I know we're not supposed to place links to this calc, is it okay to post results? I really do think this is the more accurate calc for dual claw stuff, but I'm sorry if I shouldn't have posted this.]

[Naliworld]

Sorry for the error!

BIGeyedBUG: Which calc are you referring to? As long as it isn't linking to the same site that Chippydip's calculator is hosted on, it's fair game.

brianc84: Not sure if I'm understanding this correctly, but does Trap laying have a base frame of 15(to reach a cap of 9 frames)? Also, does this base frame apply to all weapons, and not just claws?

Also, how'd you get -15 as the WSM? Sorry for all these questions, just curious to find out how Trap laying works...I was always under the impression that it worked off Normal Attack speeds.

[brianc84]

brianc84: Not sure if I'm understanding this correctly, but does Trap laying have a base frame of 15(to reach a cap of 9 frames)? Also, does this base frame apply to all weapons, and not just claws?

It is 15 base frames in the sense that the breakpoints are very close if 15 base frames are used in the formula. However, some speed calculations need more intricacy than the base+1 formula given on the diabloii.net statistics page and as a result, some (in this case just 1 breakpoint in the 0 through 75 EIAS range) will be slightly off.

This trap laying rate applies to all weapons.

Also, how'd you get -15 as the WSM? Sorry for all these questions, just curious to find out how Trap laying works...I was always under the impression that it worked off Normal Attack speeds.

For all the speed tests I've done where the primary claw is on the screen right, the equivalent WSM seems to be the Average WSM + Screen Right WSM - Screen Left WSM. I am not sure if this will work in all cases but it has worked very well so far.

[BIGeyedBUG]

Sorry for the error!

BIGeyedBUG: Which calc are you referring to? As long as it isn't linking to the same site that Chippydip's calculator is hosted on, it's fair game.


It's from d2.de--not chippydip's. I thought it had been labeled a competing site. But I'll happily be wrong.

That -15 WSM is a rough estimate of what you get when you force-equip a faster WSM primary claw screen-right with a slower secondary screen-left. It's that weird bug JRich talked about in his pinned dual-claw attack speed manifesto.

I can't help with the rest.

[jrichard]

Also, how'd you get -15 as the WSM? Sorry for all these questions, just curious to find out how Trap laying works...I was always under the impression that it worked off Normal Attack speeds.

Nali,

Just a heads up. Brianc went through a did a lot of testing on c/c attack speeds. Looks like he came up with some answers to a lot of the inconsistencies that had gotten me so frustrated i quit working on it.:) I just got back from vacation monday and have spent the whole week trying to catch up, hopefully i'll be able to go through the information he posted in the c/c attack speed thread at the AB, check with him to see if i understand it okay, and then i'll update that rambling discourse.

A question: When i do update it, how do you want me to post it? I can make a new thread and let you edit it in, i could just post it in the stickied thread, or just send it to you if you would rather.

jrichard

[Naliworld]

BIGeyedBUG: Posting results and findings from others sites is fine, it's just the link-posting that breaks the rules.

jrhcard: I think it may be a better idea to post an entirely new thread(I'll close and unsticky the old one), to minimize confusion between old replies and new replies. I'll be looking forward to the update. :)

brianc84: Thanks for the explanation...hm...this changes quite a lot.