What exp speed do you have?

[igorpotapov]

www.datascanch.ru/exp.html

This is my very simple method of character comparing. I have been used it since I started playing D2 and realized that I need an instrument of character measurement.

What is better, sorc or barbarian? This sword or that? Where is the best place for leveling?

I find answers for these basic questions, using my experience calculator. The method is simple – a thing that gives more experience per minute is better. I know “more exp” isn’t always “better”, but it IS quite often.

Is it useful to someone?

How it works? It takes information about your experience at two different times and shows you:
- experience per minute gain speed;
- progress to level 99 exp;
- how much time is needed to achieve lvl99 with that speed;
- progress to the next level;
- how much time is needed to achieve the next level with that speed;
- merc’s exp speed;
- how much time does merc need to achieve the next level with that speed.

The latest version of the calculator is single HTMP page (created with Notepad only) without additional files. You can download it with “save as single HTML” command.
I’ve test it with IE6. In my Mozilla1.5 it doesn’t work, I don’t know why.
www.datascanch.ru/exp.html

In simple please post here you exp/min speed with your build like “808113 – full tal’s lvl80 meteorb”. Thanks.

[sangfagel]

Another funny gaget of yours - he he that´s good :lol:
I think it can be usefull as a practical evaluation of exping areas but NOT characters.
For instance: If a char makes 1 mega ex/10 min is shows as better than another one making only 500k in the same time - according your measure. Nevertheless if the first char has bad def properities and dies often and the second one is just more carefull build and "never dying" one - the evaluation proves to be false.

I don´t think it´s at all possible to compair builds separately from PLAYERS. Individual preferences and playing technique are too important factors and it would be very difficult to measure them.

[igorpotapov]

If a char makes 1 mega ex/10 min is shows as better than another one making only 500k in the same time - according your measure. Nevertheless if the first char has bad def properities and dies often and the second one is just more carefull build and "never dying" one - the evaluation proves to be false.No, I don’t think so. If character dies often, it cannot have good exp/time value. Just test it over an hour. Dieing shell eat all exp speed if not negates it. However, if the first character gains more exp/time CONSTANTLY in spite of dieing, he is still better than the second.

The longer time period you use in test the more exact value you get. I don´t think it´s at all possible to compair builds separately from PLAYERS. Individual preferences and playing technique are too important factors and it would be very difficult to measure them. Yes, but we may compare character “instances”. ;-) However originally I suggested calculator for comparing things for one given player. What equipment suites him better, what characters, what areas, …

[igorpotapov]

Have anyone tried it?

[lhundertwasser]

As far as I can see this calculator does not take the experience penalty into account! Correct me if I'm wrong, but reaching lvl 98 you need 291,058,498 exp. points to lvl 99 and you receive 0.59% of experience resulting in a relative/net experience of 49.331.948.813 needed. Doing some math taking the cumulated penalty into account, you would "actually" need to get 108.067.053.642 experience points to reach lvl 98. Taking these 2 figures you can see that when just reaching lvl 98 you are ONLY 68,7% on the way to lvl 99 TOTALLY.

My calculations show this progress to lvl 99:
Lvl 10: 0,000028%
Lvl 20: 0,00034%
Lvl 30: 0,0030%
Lvl 40: 0,011%
Lvl 50: 0,030%
Lvl 60: 0,075%
Lvl 70: 0,18%
Lvl 80: 0,55%
Lvl 85: 1,2%
Lvl 90: 4,1%
Lvl 91: 5,7%
Lvl 92: 7,9%
Lvl 93: 11,1%
Lvl 94: 15,9%
Lvl 95: 22,6%
Lvl 96: 32,4%
Lvl 97: 46,9%
Lvl 98: 68,7%

Off course to some extent (at least until lvl 70 when the penalty begins) the experience gain is balanced to your level.

But when entering 285.041.630 as first screen shot (lvl 70) and 311.105.466 (lvl 71) as second screen shot, the calculator states corretly that I'm lvl 71 and 0% on the way to lvl 72, BUT it says overall completeness is 8%! A figure that comes directly from the experience points needed for lvl 99 (3.520.485.254). It states that if it takes me 1 hour to go from lvl 70 to 71 (which I think is pretty slow actually) it will only take me 123 hour to reach lvl 99, I don't think so (if that was the case why did the first ladder character reach lvl 99 only just a few months ago)

Also it does not make any sence to compare "experience per minute gains" at lvl 70 or even lvl 80 with lvl 98 (unless you take the penalty into account), you can in NO way keep the same speed at level 98.

Now, this is not meant at all a critique of your idea, I think it is (maybe not usefull) but it's good fun. I just think that maybe you should consider taking the penalty into account, making it more precise/useful/fun.

[VanMuhr]

I thought that my lvl 90 barb had come a long way :teeth: LOL he is only 4,1% done :scared:
With that future for him I dont think he will ever come any further :lol:

[igorpotapov]

I invented this system when I was playing 1.07.

It is easy to change the calculator. In 1.09 after you had got 3,520,485,254 experience points you achieve level 99. In 1.10 you need more experience.
I will calculate this number and improve the calculator. It will be very easy with “version 1.10” checkbox, witch will change “3,520,485,254” constant.
I just need some time, I’m at my job now. ;-)

Thanks.

[igorpotapov]

I’m in doubt.

For example player achieves level 98 and his exp speed in 10000 per minute. How many exp he needs to collect for level 99? I think steel 291,058,498. Experience, witch he gains, is already reduced by 6/1024 penalty.

For example another player is level 90. How many exp he needs for level 99? I think steel 3 520 485 254-current_exp. Not more.

Yes, penalty exists. However you don’t need more experience to reach level 99. The penalty just restricts your experience gain speed.

So “progress to level 99” bar in the calculator is correct. The only doubtful value is “time to level 99”. However, as description in the calc says: “You must keep this experience gain speed”. And this is impossible in the 1.10 becouse of restrictions.

Yes at level 70 you can see, that “you need 123 hours to achieve level 99”, however this is only assumption.
At level 98 you should get the same times in “time to the next level” and “time to level 99”.

The closer you are to level 99 the more exact assumption you get!

[lhundertwasser]

You are to some extent right, your progress to level 99 is not wrong, but what I mean is that you show the progress as sort of "one-dimensional". It is correct that you do not need more experience points, but you need to gather more exp. to lvl. From lvl 98 to lvl 99 you are right, you need 291.058.498 experience points to lvl, but taking the penalty into account you would need to gather 100*291.058.498/0.49 = 59.399.693.469 experience points, which is the one you need to use when talking experience speed IMHO.

I would still argue that your time and progress IS wrong because when getting 10.000 exp/min at level 69 and keeping up that speed will actually only get you 59 exp/min at lvl 98, OR you would have to keep the speed WITH the penalty that is actually getting approx 2.000.000 exp/min which I don't see is possible (these figures should not be taken literally though, but seen relative you should get the point!) and it is muuuch harder work getting exp. at lvl 98 or even 90 that at level 70 and takes a muuuuch longer time.

You are absolutely correct that your calculator is right in the mentioned "one-dimensional" perspective, but the fun part of the calculator (as I see it) is to actually see what your progress is (and perhaps the time) and that does not give a correct picture (IMHO).

[EDIT] And yes it is more accurate the closer you get to lvl 99, because the closer you get to level 99, the more the penalties will converge and give you a better result. From lvl X to X+1 your calculator WILL show the correct result, due to the delta-exp is the actual speed (which wouldn't be the case for X to X+2 for example)

[igorpotapov]

Lets assume that a character has achieved level 90. His current experience is 1,700,000,000. Hi can harvest 10,000 experiences per minute (after all restrictions) at that point.
Can you figure out his progress percentage to level 99 and the estimated time? How to calculate it correctly?

[lhundertwasser]

If he is lvl 90 and has 1,700,000,000 exp. he would need 64.543.065 to reach lvl 91 (1.764.543.065), taking the penalty (5,96%) for lvl 90, you would need to gather 64.543.065/5,96% = 1.082.937.332 experience points to level, from lvl 91->99 you would need to gather an additional 148.497.267.240 exp. points totalling to 149.580.204.572 exp. point needed to be "gathered" (but only 1.529.426.756 penaliced/real exp. points).

Lets assume that you can keep the speed of 10.000 exp/min at lvl 90 through lvl 99. If you have gotten excactly 10.000 exp. point in the character screen at lvl, taking the penalty into account, you have gathered 167.785 exp/min. Taking this "penaliced" exp. speed into account you would reach lvl 99 in 149.580.204.572/167.785 = 891.499 minutes = 619 days which is an awfully long time :) (so I guess the speed is a bit low for "real life" but its ok for illustraing the idea). But that's just best case scenario, if you keep the same killing speed at lvl 90 through lvl 99, it will also be penalized off course (we have to calculate in the penalized experience points through everything). So the penalty corrected experience speed "table" will be:

lvl 90: 10.000 exp/min (penalized 10.000/5,96% = 167.785)
lvl 91: 7.534 exp/min (= 167.785*4,49%)
lvl 92: 5.738 exp/min (= 167.785*3,42%)
lvl 93: 4.262 exp/min (= 167.785*2,54%)
lvl 94: 3.272 exp/min (= 167.785*1,95%)
lvl 95: 2.450 exp/min (= 167.785*1,46%)
lvl 96: 1.795 exp/min (= 167.785*1,07%)
lvl 97: 1.309 exp/min (= 167.785*0,78%)
lvl 98: 990 exp/min (= 167.785*0,59%)

That means that if you keep the same killing speed at lvl 90 through lvl 99 (worst-case scenario, i.e. you are not able to increase your penalized exp. speed, i.e. the 167.785!) you would reach lvl 99 in:

SUM(EXP_LVL(X, X+1)/EXP_SPEED(X))

Where EXP_LVL(X, X+1) designates the needed exp to be gathered to go from level X to level X+1, i.e for level 91 to 92 it would be 2.450.879.966 (where the "real" exp. points shown in the character screen and listed on Arreat, is 159.218.965), EXP_SPEED(X) is the penalized exp. speed at level X, i.e.:

EXP_SPEED(X) = PENALTY(X) * MEASURED_SPEED / PENALTY(CURRENT_LEVEL)

I will list the calculations for you where EXP_LVL(90, 91) is the above listed 1.082.937.332 due to already being at 1.700.000.000. Here goes:

SPEED = 1.082.937.332/10.000 + 2.450.879.966/7.534 + 3.546.079.399/5.738 + 5.074.522.602/4.262 + 7.447.561.142/3.272 + 10.574.009.077/2.450 + 15.393.874.247/1.795 + 22.895.150.935/1.309 + 34.234.121.026/990 = 69.486.142 minutes = 48.254 days which I guess is an even longer time :p. Again I would guess the exp. speed is MORE than 10.000 at level 90!???, since I don't think the level 99's have been playing fulltime the 132 years it would take :)

I have no idea of what a real exp. speed is at level 90 could be, but sitting here watching this result makes me ponder on the calculations. Does anybody have a real figure for an experience speed at level 90, then I would be happy to check the results and see if they come up with something that makes sense (cause 132 years don't that's for sure :D)

[igorpotapov]

First of all I must correct you at penalty calculations. The game doesn’t calculate 0.49% of gained exp at lvl98 as Arreat says. It multiplies it by 6, divides by 1024 and rounds down the result
to nearest integer. Here is the table for all levels (see experience.txt file).

Level ExpRatio
70 976
71 928
72 880
73 832
74 784
75 736
76 688
77 640
78 592
79 544
80 496
81 448
82 400
83 352
84 304
85 256
86 192
87 144
88 108
89 81
90 61
91 46
92 35
93 26
94 20
95 15
96 11
97 8
98 6
99 5
I will list the calculations for you where EXP_LVL(90, 91) is the above listed 1.082.937.332 due to already being at 1.700.000.000. Here goes:

SPEED = 1.082.937.332/10.000 + 2.450.879.966/7.534 + 3.546.079.399/5.738 + 5.074.522.602/4.262 + 7.447.561.142/3.272 + 10.574.009.077/2.450 + 15.393.874.247/1.795 + 22.895.150.935/1.309 + 34.234.121.026/990 = 69.486.142 minutes = 48.254 days which I guess is an even longer time

What does it mean? I don’t understand. Speed=Exp/speed?

I have no idea of what a real exp. speed is at level 90 could be, but sitting here watching this result makes me ponder on the calculations. Does anybody have a real figure for an experience speed at level 90, then I would be happy to check the results and see if they come up with something that makes sense (cause 132 years don't that's for sure )
At the start of the calculator you can see real numbers for my 1.10 necro (pure bone without ****ing boots). So his penalized exp speed at level 88 is 334,854 per minute.

Anyway I will think about your suggestions more and improve the calculator when I will have a bit of free time.

Thanks.

[igorpotapov]

How about the fallowing:

TIME_TO_99=EXP_TO(91)/SPEED(90)+EXP_TO(92)/SPEED(91)+…+ EXP_TO(99)/SPEED(98),

where

SPEED(90)=10000,
CURRENT_EXP=1700000000,
EXP(1)=0,
EXP(2)=500,
…
EXP(99)= 3520485254,
ExpRatio(1)=1024,
ExpRatio(2)=1024,
…
ExpRatio(98)=6,
SPEED(N)= ( (SPEED(90)/( ExpRatio(90)/1024))* ExpRatio (N)/1024),
EXP_TO(91)=EXP(91)-CURRENT_EXP,
EXP_TO(N)=EXP(N)-EXP(N-1).

Progress_to_99=100*(Current_exp_with_penalty/Exp_at_99_with_penalty),

where

Current_exp_with_penaly= (EXP_TO(2)/ (ExpRatio(1)/1024))+ (EXP_TO(3)/ (ExpRatio(3)/1024))+ … + (EXP_TO(N)/ (ExpRatio(N-1)/1024))+ … + (EXP_TO(90)/ (ExpRatio(89)/1024))+ ((CURRENT_EXP-EXP(90))/ (ExpRatio(90)/1024)),

Exp_at_99_with_penalty= (EXP_TO(2)/ (ExpRatio(1)/1024))+ (EXP_TO(3)/ (ExpRatio(3)/1024))+ … + (EXP_TO(N)/ (ExpRatio(N-1)/1024))+ … + (EXP_TO(99)/ (ExpRatio(98)/1024)).

Don’t forget that the game likes to round down numbers. So when you kill monster at level 90 with 10000 exp/kill, you get 595 exp, not 596 (10000*61/1024=595.7031).

Using these formulas we can calculate:

SPEED(90)=10000,
SPEED(91)=7540,
SPEED(92)=5737,
SPEED(93)=4262,
SPEED(94)=3278,
SPEED(95)=2459,
SPEED(96)=1803,
SPEED(97)=1311,
SPEED(98)=983,

TIME_TO_99=( 1764543065-1700000000)/10000+
+159218965/7540+
+173548673/5737+
+189168053/4262+
+206193177/3278+
+224750564/2459+
+244978115/1803+
+267026144/1311+
+291058498/983= 577731,9 minutes = 9628,9 hours = 401 days.

If exp speed at level 90 is 300000, than
TIME_TO_99= 19251 min = 321 hours. It is more realistic value, isn’t it?

Lets calculate the progress to level 99.

Current_exp_with_penaly=4,157,737,296.
Exp_at_99_with_penalty= 157,534,021,807.
Progress_to_99=2.64%.

Is this correct?