What's wrong with my PVP WWbaba?!?!?!?!

[sorrysuki]

eh? i've built up a WW barbarian. i found that i can't win in PVP, what's wrong, it seems that my damage is not high enuff

COA with Um (all resist 60, damage reduced 15%)
Highlord's Wrath (31% Deadly Strike)
Set A: 2 Grandfather (230, 243ED)
Set B: Azure Wrath + 148 Stormshield
Leviathan 23% damage reduced
2 BK Ring
Anarchnid Mesh
Gorerider (Deadly Strike, Open wounds, Crushing Blow)
Steelrend (Crushing Blow)
10x 100pdsc, 10x 50pdsc, 5x Combat Gc, 5x all resist Gc

should i aim at one thing (speed, damage or whatever...)
My damage is too low, and my defense is too low
And I DUN HAVE AN ENIGMA.....so what should i use?!?!?!?!

20 Sword Mastery
20 Increase Speed
20 Whirlwind
5 Natural Resistance
20 Battle Order

Stat. 170 to strength, 100 to dex, other to vitality

PLZ help me, thxxxx

[gmoura]

for one thing! GF is TOO slow for WW, and it sounds like you are havinf Attack Rating problems!

if i where you i would definatly use a shield (SS) and try and get a high damage weapon that reaches the WW break point!

Defence is very important in PvP unless goin against casters, so take off the shield when goin against a sorc for example!

my barb does ok in PvP, and i always make sure i got enough AR.
try using the angelic ammy+ring for the AR boost!
try and get your damage reduction to 50% if its not thur already!

in my opinion, when goin to PvP against barbs and pallys! these are important!
- High defence
- Shield
- damage reduction
- speed
- ATTACK RATING !!!!!!!!
- oh, and of course, resists!

try and maximise all of these!!!

hope this helps dude!

[spencert]

Wow... u've pretty screwed-up this build:

1) COA - Bad choice, WW barb only use 09 arreats. Period.
2) Highlords - Highlords with 2 x ravens or angelic set. Period.
3) 2 x GF - probably better off with azure + gf for pvm
4) Azure + SS - Better off with 27x ed death cleaver + ss / for sword probably a good high ed rare cb.
5) Leviathan - Try new rune word, Duress, on archon plate.
6) BK rings - refer to 2
7) Anarchid mesh - Verdungos only, anarchid only when u have engima + wizardspike against casters.
8) gore - ok
9) steelrend - ok
10) pdsc, combat gc etc - better off with max/ar/life sc

Dex 100 - not enough for max block, make sure u get max block with angelic set.
Str - enough to wear heaviest item
life - everything else

20 Sword Mastery - ok, max axe mastery if going for death cleaver
20 Increase Speed - wasted points. 1 point enough.
20 Whirlwind - ok
5 Natural Resistance - wasted points. 1 point enough
20 Battle Order - ok
Shout - need to max
Battle command - 1 point
Iron skin - rest of points

Overall... u need to rebuild your barb if u want to do some serious pvp.

[Krazy_Solo]

I suggest rebuilding...

To much strength (Should only have a base with out plus stats of 90 - 130)
Dex should be high enough for max block with ss (Include plus dex stat items)...

You should easily put 200 - 300 stat points in Vitality...

Skills should look more like this

20 WW
20 Weapon Mastery
20 Battle Order
20 Shout
1 Battle Command
5 - 10 Increase Speed
5 - 8 Natural Resistance
1 Berserk

Items for the poor dueler would be following (Upgrade if you have better)

IK Gaunt and Belt or Boots
Raven Frost Ring
Rare LL ring or Blood Crafted Ring
Angelic ring and Ammy if you lack AR
Crescent Moon Ammy or Cats Eye
Cruel Colossal Blade with 2 x shael (add Amn runes if Quickness mod)
"Rhyme" Shield, Whistan's Shield, "Sanctuary" Shield
Shaftstop, "Duress" Armor, "Prudence" Armor
Arreats Face (There is no substitution for a WhirlWind BARB)
String of Ears, Whilhelm Pride Belt,
Goblin Toe, War Travs, Gore Riders
2x Echoe Weapons on Switch

+ Life SC, + AR SC, + Dam SC, Faster R/W SC, FHR SC

As you can see by rebuilding you can easily improve your live by 500 life easily...

Depending on Weapon you have you can reach 2k - 3k Damage with the right Charms...

If you cannot afford 3/20/20 sc go for Strength charms (each strength charm = 1% damage boost...)

with Gear all together you should have roughly 200+ Strength, 222 dex at lvl 99, and over 200 Vita...

Damage should be over 2k
Life should be near 5k
Should Reach 50% DR

[LordDrift]

A good WW barb will need.

1. Attack Rating: 10K+
2. Defense: More the better, mine has 16k
3. Decent Damage 4k or Above
4. Massive Life: 4.5k or more (mine has 5.1k)
5. 75% Block

[Halciet]

I completely concur with Spencer's post. He's got it all covered right there.

[spencert]

Wow Hal, what a vote of confidence. :thumbsup:

Anyway, learned some of those stuff thru u. :lol:

[Joe_smith]

barb is a gear hog first get really rich before thinking of making a good pvp barb. and casters are the way to go for starters.

[Soepgroente]

Don't forget 1 zerk, it can be handy sometimes. I say lvl 14 increased speed after equipment (40%), but you can get by with lvl 10 (36%).

[spencert]

barb is a gear hog first get really rich before thinking of making a good pvp barb. and casters are the way to go for starters.

Ya man... those max/ar/life charms are the real killers. Especially on ladder, so hard to get. I'm not even going for 3/20/20 sc... just 3/ar/18 ~ 19 sc. Still cost a bomb.

[Hex]

Here is my honest opinion. Max damage owns poison damage anyday. 'Nuff said

Good luck building your barb.

E z

[Ghostmourne]

helm definately go arreats

as for the amulet... dunno whats so great about highlords.... between highlords and the cats eye i use now, i can safely say i like cats eye better.

-metalgrid aint half bad either

as for the rings, id recoomend going raven/bul kathos

gloves, rends are fine, but i prefer draculs

annnd your skills...

not sure why spencer thinks more than 1 in inc speed is a waste... most good barbs have at least 5-10 on it

natural res is not a waste. if u dont have enough resist and can get it by dropped 5 points into natural res, go for it. i wouldnt put more than 5 in thise though

annnnd maxing shout isnt an absolute must... but it does help alot. i usually max skin before shout though. i get more def with my equip that way

[Halciet]

Ghost:

-Highlord's is chosen because of the deadly strike; at higher levels, that makes 1 in 3 attacks do double damage. This, along with the ias for normal swing attacks, is why it's so popular.

-bk isn't a great ring for pvp, since all you get off of it is a maximum of 49 life (as leech is nerfed in pvp). That life isn't multiplied by BO, since the BO changes; thus, dual ravens is usually better, since you can save 20 dex and get 20 more vit, along with AR. Angelic is also popular for melee dueling.

-Draculs are pointless for whirlwind, since lifetap won't trigger on whirl and as I mentioned leech is nerfed in pvp.

-Most good barbs had 5-14 in 1.09, but in 1.10, most of the best duelers only have 1 point in it, if any. Enigma has taken a lot of the emphasis off of running.

-Natural resist is not a waste, no, but since it doesn't have synergies and you can get max resists with just one point in it +skill items, those points are usually better spent somewhere else.

-Your armor gives more defense with ironskin? How so? Shout gives 70% more defense than ironskin does (100 vs 30 at level 1, 290 vs 220 at level 20), and shout also boosts bcomm/bo durations and berserk damage, and helps both you and the party/merc. I see no reason why you would max ironskin before shout.

-Hal

-Hal

[shaftstop]

You dont nessarily need 09 Arreats for WW barb mine isn't.
Lava gouts are good gloves too.

My ww looks slike this, 20WW 20SM 20BO 20Shout 4Iron skin 5natural resistance (at 1 even with gear ss/arreats ect, I wasn't able to come close to max resists w/ +skills with 5 I am 75 in all but like 2 skills hell, but since im mostly melee it hasn't bothered me much) I also had 1 increased speed and stamina, but as I level I plan to get a couple more points in there well atleast 2-3 base and work on iron skin

my gear I use is arreats, tgods, angelics/highlords (if barbs insist on con) because apprently WW isn't melee.. even though disctionary says otherwise *shrug* heh. As long as spells aren't used...but eh whatever :p
I also use razors edge lava gouts and gore riders. I carry Lacerator but I dunno to me that seems BM, I could be wrong but if people get on my nerves I tend to pull that out rather soonish. I also wear Stone archon 2.1k def with 103 str requirement :) very proud of that armor stumbled across it totally by accident so I checked around and saw I was able to make Stone out of it.
Draculs is only form of decient leech in PvP that works really well. Just not with WW.
Right now I am sitting at 3.4k life with BO 19834def 11kAR without enchant (lv 10) My damage isn't to hot though but i am using RAzor Edge + Gores to make up for the difference heh until I get better.

My only regret aout my build is speed I do wish i was faster with run/walk but heard different things about run/walk affecting WW hits/speed, but other then that my barb is great. with the thanks of ppl here who helped me clear a few clouds hopefully this will help you with some ideas.

I dunno much about swords but if you insist on using GF maybe concetrate barb would be good since you can use weapon+item IAS.

[MaSta-AdamTwo]

make sure when ur WW dueling hit the "r" key so u walk, cause ur block rate will go up. when u have run on ur block rate is cut down to 50% i think. i mean ur not gonna need to run from a WW baba unless u stink.

[Ghostmourne]

Ghost:

-Highlord's is chosen because of the deadly strike; at higher levels, that makes 1 in 3 attacks do double damage. This, along with the ias for normal swing attacks, is why it's so popular.

-bk isn't a great ring for pvp, since all you get off of it is a maximum of 49 life (as leech is nerfed in pvp). That life isn't multiplied by BO, since the BO changes; thus, dual ravens is usually better, since you can save 20 dex and get 20 more vit, along with AR. Angelic is also popular for melee dueling.

-Draculs are pointless for whirlwind, since lifetap won't trigger on whirl and as I mentioned leech is nerfed in pvp.

-Most good barbs had 5-14 in 1.09, but in 1.10, most of the best duelers only have 1 point in it, if any. Enigma has taken a lot of the emphasis off of running.

-Natural resist is not a waste, no, but since it doesn't have synergies and you can get max resists with just one point in it +skill items, those points are usually better spent somewhere else.

-Your armor gives more defense with ironskin? How so? Shout gives 70% more defense than ironskin does (100 vs 30 at level 1, 290 vs 220 at level 20), and shout also boosts bcomm/bo durations and berserk damage, and helps both you and the party/merc. I see no reason why you would max ironskin before shout.

-Hal

-Hal

yeah i realize why people use it... but why people dont use cats is my turmoil... imo cats is 2x better than lords, but thats just my opinion

in any melee Vs. melee duel, using a few cons to cas the life tap on draculs is simple. i should have specified why and when i preferred them

hmmm must be some private dueling ring thing on the speed... havnt met one good barb with less than 3-5 points in it, oh well. i realize enigma takes SOME emphasis off running, but enigma is sometimes more likely to get you killed than to save your arse... hence running is still important

and iron skin gives me more resists because it doesnt have to be cast mostly. most of the more interesting duels i have last to the point of where shout wears off. also, higher iron skin= higher base def= more def given by shout. so theres another reason you might max skin first. once again, these are my preferences. but as long as im winning a hell of alot more than losing, im keeping my views the same lolz

[Halciet]

Alright, fair enough, the only problem with the logic is still the ironskin argument. Ironskin doesn't add to base defense, it just adds an extra %, so shout doesn't multiply that total. All shout takes into account is your defense from armor/items and dexterity. Skill defense is applied afterwards.

Besides, with 20 BO/20 Shout, it lasts a long, long time.

As for the good barbs with less than 3-5 points of inc speed...l2aider didn't have any points in inc speed, and he was the best barb around, until he shipped out with the Navy last month.

-Hal

[Rostedt]

- 25% OW from draculs is often more pvp dmg than 60/20 steelrends. Specially now as you dont seem to have botd. Draculs is better than rends in many 1h botd setups even.
- "Standard build" skill bp for inc speed has been 40% with gear(and with bc in 1.10), but many who duel in leagues or other organised enviroment with rw caps and etc, put more in it. High run correctly used still pwns most opponents.

[Ghostmourne]

well i wouldnt go so far as to say there was a best barb around because i havnt met a barb that i havnt been able to kill yet. Not to mention some of the greatest players are old school players and have quit due to newbs and bots running rampant lol.

also, being ironskin increased the defense of my armor, when the raised the defense i got with shout, i assumed that the defense it was adding was being calculated. perhaps something else is causing the defense increases

[fallen angel of satan]

I was goin to come here and give my advice but it seems he has had enough alrdy :\ lol as for iron skin/ shout thing, I always max shout, then at the end of the day put the rest of my points in iron skin, bcoz shout improves duration of bo, bc it also helps party, and you get the same defence increase per lvl (after the 1st lvl) so basically shout has more advantages than iron skin. 1 point in increased speed is fine really, wether or not you use enigma, bcoz the barbs cast rate is too slow to tele everywhere.

The reason some people like dracul's is the open wounds(does this go on ww, i think it does) but i like steelrend better and also the open wounds is considered bm by some.

Ghostmourne my barb was never beatan(he was pure bvb so i am talking by another barb, casters owned him, lol) when I had him, but I know for sure that he wasnt the best barb around.

Back to the origonal question though, you dont need enigma to own, instead get insane run/walk.

[thesecondrei]

^And how much r/w do you recommned???

[fallen angel of satan]

I recomend 110% (with increased speed bonus) I think the breakpoint after this is something like 200% :\

[Joe_smith]

Alright, fair enough, the only problem with the logic is still the ironskin argument. Ironskin doesn't add to base defense, it just adds an extra %, so shout doesn't multiply that total. All shout takes into account is your defense from armor/items and dexterity. Skill defense is applied afterwards.

Besides, with 20 BO/20 Shout, it lasts a long, long time.

As for the good barbs with less than 3-5 points of inc speed...l2aider didn't have any points in inc speed, and he was the best barb around, until he shipped out with the Navy last month.

-Hal


i think he put 0 in increased speed to be slow on purpose. ww gets more hits when you move slower. in 1.09 ww was same as walk speed so it hit many times. in 1.10 it's run speed and if you have increased speed and a lot of frw ur ww won't be hitting as much.

also dracul's are far from useless for a ww barb, like rosetdebt said the 25% ow is probalby more pvp damage than 60/20 steel rends and the 15 str isn't bad either.

[Soepgroente]

I recomend 110% (with increased speed bonus) I think the breakpoint after this is something like 200% :\
There's no breakpoint. I wouldn't use many charms for r/w. Use gore's+enigma and you're fine. 08 highlord is an option for 30 r/w on NL but it's likely duped.

[The_Redemptor]

GF is an ok sword for PvP. Not the best, by far, but it definitely doesn't 'suck' if you know what you're doing.
Botd is an ok sword for PvP. 99% of those are duped so don't wonder if your runes disappear suddenly. Botd has one very significant weakness: Attack Rating.

Your best choice is any rare sword that gets the 'Fool's' Prefix together with a good 'Enhanced Damage' Prefix (100%+ is good). Sure you noticed how fast you run out of mana if you don't hit. Attack rating is (to some extent) more important than godly damage !