how many fcr does pvp pal need?

[floodforever]

i am hammer/charge din.

[Pravda]

try 48. if you think it's too slow, use 75 instead

[Zardoz]

For PvP lots of people try to hit the 125% breakpoint.

[floodforever]

For PvP lots of people try to hit the 125% breakpoint.
but i am charge/bh din.

[jumbo_SHRIMP]

charge does enough damage without specific gear(except nasty weapon) play around with your gear some, rings and amulets should be crafted ones for mage/melee builds imo, they are the only things that give chars the flexibility they need

phelix

[Tanatus]

If you want to kill anything that capable to move with hammer you need have 125FCR

[Pravda]

If you want to kill anything that capable to move with hammer you need have 125FCR

explain why

[strength_honor]

unless using Stormshield there isnt any good way to get max FCR and DR at the same time.

against 7fps TPing zon or Wind Druid without max DR is bad.

[Tanatus]

explain why
You can teleport on top of 10FPC hammerding and kill him with tornado,bone spear or hammer w.o been killed in retaliation - cannt do same with 9FPS
Same thing on attack 10FPC not fast enouth to land 2-3 succesfull hits (assuming your listed hammer damage 10K (1.7K PvP)-15k (2.5K PvP)). Its realtively safe to assume that PvP chars usually have 3-5Khp life hence you need hit target 3 time to be sure that you score kill
About PDR well if you so inclinched to have max PDR go with
Ber Shako (18%), Ber HoZ (8%), Enigma (8%) which is 34% PDR or get exile sheild which most likely will push you AC well over 10K and as a such make you immune to bowones attacks (they have way to low AR to brake trough). With wind druid - just be faster - with 9FPC hammer zero chance that wind druid can land on you and yet survive since Cyclone armor wont protect against hammers) Bonners different story thou :cheesy: bone armor will absorb first 1-2 hammers

[Pravda]

You can teleport on top of 10FPC hammerding and kill him with tornado,bone spear or hammer w.o been killed in retaliation - cannt do same with 9FPS
Same thing on attack 10FPC not fast enouth to land 2-3 succesfull hits (assuming your listed hammer damage 10K (1.7K PvP)-15k (2.5K PvP)). Its realtively safe to assume that PvP chars usually have 3-5Khp life hence you need hit target 3 time to be sure that you score kill
About PDR well if you so inclinched to have max PDR go with
Ber Shako (18%), Ber HoZ (8%), Enigma (8%) which is 34% PDR or get exile sheild which most likely will push you AC well over 10K and as a such make you immune to bowones attacks (they have way to low AR to brake trough). With wind druid - just be faster - with 9FPC hammer zero chance that wind druid can land on you and yet survive since Cyclone armor wont protect against hammers) Bonners different story thou :cheesy: bone armor will absorb first 1-2 hammers

So you say that a wind druid who is stupid enough to telepost on top of a hammerdin would have the advantage even if the hammerdin used the 10frame break? A winddruid can only cast at 11 at the most, does less damage, and has ****ty fhr, but would still have the advantage? Weird...

Also, guided arrow ignores defense so exile would be useless.

Bone armor only absorbs physical attacks.

[Tanatus]

With winder it will be all about connection and reaction. He need connected to you ~1 hurican hit + 2-3 tornado (more like 3-4) vs. you need 2-3 hammers (more like 3-4 taking in account oak sage). Dont underestimate FHR - most casters running at 24-36%FHR at very minimum but so is you (my hammerdin who pure PvM MF/rusher built running at 28FHR
Are you sure druids maximum FPC is 11 and not 8 for tornado?

[Pravda]

With winder it will be all about connection and reaction. He need connected to you ~1 hurican hit + 2-3 tornado (more like 3-4) vs. you need 2-3 hammers (more like 3-4 taking in account oak sage). Dont underestimate FHR - most casters running at 24-36%FHR at very minimum but so is you (my hammerdin who pure PvM MF/rusher built running at 28FHR
Are you sure druids maximum FPC is 11 and not 8 for tornado?

Druid's faster cast:

12 frames = 68%
11 frames = 99%
10 frames = 163%

10 frames is not feasible.

So theoretically, a druid should never be able to tele on top of you, but it depends on connection and reaction as you said. Also, druids in human form need to sacrifice a lot more to get to the same fhr frame as pallys.

[Tanatus]

ya 163 FCR extremely hard to achieve yet some sorcs (speed freaks lol) able brake mark 200 FCR (fogot what this give 6 or 7 FPC rate)
About FHR - heh most ppl handle it via GC skillers/FHR or vita of stability (20life/5fhr)

[Pravda]

ya 163 FCR extremely hard to achieve yet some sorcs (speed freaks lol) able brake mark 200 FCR (fogot what this give 6 or 7 FPC rate)
About FHR - heh most ppl handle it via GC skillers/FHR or vita of stability (20life/5fhr)

I don't think you understand me. Most classes have different fhr tables. A druid in human form needs 99 fhr (I think) for 6 frames. A pally only needs 27 fhr. Thus, pallys don't have to sacrifice as much for fhr. Also, good luck finding vita of stability charms, unless you play on open ><

[strength_honor]

Only 10-15k hammer kill in 3-5 hits...

BUt to achieve that much optimal damage, you will have to rely on a High Dmg weapon to give you charge as a viable attack... being have to rely on 125%FCR to kill and the physical dmg part of Charge to force people into DR gear is not reasonable in TP duels... so Wind-Druid can have 4 facets shield on one side and stormshield on another. Even with Raven Frost to absorb it is still hard to deal with massive cold dmg from the hurricane if they choose to use alot cold facets.

[Tanatus]

Only 10-15k hammer kill in 3-5 hits...

BUt to achieve that much optimal damage, you will have to rely on a High Dmg weapon to give you charge as a viable attack... being have to rely on 125%FCR to kill and the physical dmg part of Charge to force people into DR gear is not reasonable in TP duels... so Wind-Druid can have 4 facets shield on one side and stormshield on another. Even with Raven Frost to absorb it is still hard to deal with massive cold dmg from the hurricane if they choose to use alot cold facets.
Mmm hammers damage dont depend on weapon of your choice.... only on skills
125FCR/10K hammer or 75FCR/13K hammer with absorb/max resist is fairly easy to achieve but getting 125FCR AND 15K hammer you need truely godly gear. Most likely you will need godly circlet something like 2skill/20FCR/30resist all/2 sockets with Ber, rare boots with FRW/FHR/heavy resistance/Life, also you will need to spend a lot time shopping for scepter that have +3 combat skill/3BH/3Conc/20FCR, +3combat/20FCR magic ammulet and so it goes

[strength_honor]

+3 combat skill/3BH/3Conc/20FCR, +3combat/20FCR magic ammulet and so it goes

None of those are spawnable.

you only get 10% FCR at max on a magical ammy or scepter(scepter bugged ever since LOD)

"Magus 20% Faster Cast Rate Circlets(17), Orbs(17), Rods(17)"


Of cause I know BH rely on +skills -_-

But your charge isnt hurting anyone in hammer switch. So people dont have to fear as much. Then it is Cold Facets go go time for windy =(

[Tanatus]

its suffix not perfix ..
of apprentice and if I not minstaken one should be looking for
Rose branded ammulet of apprentice (3 combat 20FCR(?))
But anyway lets look where from FCR will come
arachnids 20, hoto 40, magefirst 20, circlet 20, say ammulet 10 and 2 rings X10 = 130 but ... no absorb

[Pravda]

its suffix not perfix ..
of apprentice and if I not minstaken one should be looking for
Rose branded ammulet of apprentice (3 combat 20FCR(?))
But anyway lets look where from FCR will come
arachnids 20, hoto 40, magefirst 20, circlet 20, say ammulet 10 and 2 rings X10 = 130 but ... no absorb

I doubt you will have more than 200 mana with that setup.

[Tanatus]

I doubt you will have more than 200 mana with that setup.
Nah a bit more then that ...
usual set up for 10FCR rings includes at least 50 mana on each like ..
10FCR 39 life 56 mana 29 LR for example (I have such) so to speak 100+ mana comes just from rings along
Boot usually rare FRW/FHR/20+ life/30+ mana/massive resist
+ what ever mana will comes with Anni
+ mana from rare circlet
+5% boost from arachnids
With ideal gear you can get plently mana

[Pravda]

Nah a bit more then that ...
usual set up for 10FCR rings includes at least 50 mana on each like ..
10FCR 39 life 56 mana 29 LR for example (I have such) so to speak 100+ mana comes just from rings along
Boot usually rare FRW/FHR/20+ life/30+ mana/massive resist
+ what ever mana will comes with Anni
+ mana from rare circlet
+5% boost from arachnids
With ideal gear you can get plently mana

From my own experience, anything less than 600 is a big disadvantage. But of course I don't use teleport either -_-

[Tanatus]

From my own experience, anything less than 600 is a big disadvantage. But of course I don't use teleport either -_-
Well I left outside of discussion armor and if you dont using enigma then upped viper allow you brake 125FCR mark w/o using rings/ammulets which give you obvious more flexiblity with absorb/PDR gear ... but teleporting on top of target to big advantage to give it up :evil: ... My buit for now pure MF/rushing clone but even for that teleporting on top of boss is garant that first 3-4 hammer will get connected. My hammerdin running at ~470mana/1700life - have zero problem I'd even guessing that this built work well with 350-400 mana...
Btw small derailing here I have for fun purpose maximum FOH built .... here you right - no way templar can be efficient with less then 600

[strength_honor]

its suffix not perfix ..
of apprentice and if I not minstaken one should be looking for
Rose branded ammulet of apprentice (3 combat 20FCR(?))
But anyway lets look where from FCR will come
arachnids 20, hoto 40, magefirst 20, circlet 20, say ammulet 10 and 2 rings X10 = 130 but ... no absorb


of Magus is the suffix and it is the only one with 20% FCR ! Rare only on 3 things

of Apprentice is the only 10% FCR suffix !

OMG ! Go look at arreat summit plz

that setup offers no sufficient DR% against Tornado or G-Arrow.

[Tanatus]

rare circlet can have 2 ber in it (16 PDR)
HOZ - 1 Ber (8)
24PDR +75% fastest block is sufficient to take care about GA
with winder you will have advantage with faster FPC rate 11 is for druid 9 for you - you should be able get off 4 hammers vs. 3 tornado. But as I said above with teleporting winders all about connection and reaction

[Pravda]

rare circlet can have 2 ber in it (16 PDR)
HOZ - 1 Ber (8)
24PDR +75% fastest block is sufficient to take care about GA
with winder you will have advantage with faster FPC rate 11 is for druid 9 for you - you should be able get off 4 hammers vs. 3 tornado. But as I said above with teleporting winders all about connection and reaction

You'll definitely need 50%pdr against any zon who knows how to use a bow.

[Tanatus]

Teleport on top of zone and hammer zone down? - you need just 2 hammers connected in most cases may be 3. Amazons dont have much life

[Pravda]

Teleport on top of zone and hammer zone down? - you need just 2 hammers connected in most cases may be 3. Amazons dont have much life

Are you on east?

[Tanatus]

Yes. But looking forward for your next question - dont have enigma yet on my best hammerdin so he not yet mobile enouth + he is pure MF (aka every **** that can be used for MF used for it lol) buit but I am not mind run him for PvP test with good bowzone (he at 125FCR/9.2K hammers/max resist in hell/8%PDR)