PvM Avenger in HC

[Vectom]

Hi,

I want to make a perfect Avenger for HC ladder. I aim for max res all (95/95/95/90), lot of absorb, high dr and def and ofc kickass damage.

The skill setup would be:
20 Vengeance
20 Conv
20 HS
10 Fire/Light/Cold res. auras

The items I plan to wear:
CoA (Res/IAS,Res/IAS)
GA (upg.,UM)
Stormlash (ED/IAS)
HoZ (upg.,UM)
String (perf.,upg.)
LoH
Gores (upg.)
Highlords
Raven (perf.)
Dwarf
Anni

This will get me, max fps (8), with few res. charms max res., 30dr, absorb all but poison :) and high defense.

Questions:
Is this good for PvM? Have no previous experience with avengers. Will I kill and live in hell? Whatabout PvP, are there any avengers? Is there a better item setup? Plz only valid reasons.

Thx in advance

Vect :bow:

[sexyfool]

I am making a pvm hcl avenger right now, just hit 49 nm a4. Yes nm a4. These guys are great tanks and can push ahead faster than most builds I have used in hcl. Your build is fine as per the thread in the guides list but I see a few problems you may need to address.

Mana loss.

This is the hardest part of your lvl 26 (with plus skills on equipment shown) vengeance build. It is a very mana intensive skill and I don't think u have shown any mana leech at all. You can sort that out 1 of two ways. Drop the dwarf for a manald or rare mana leech ring or, as per the guide, drop only a single pt in vengeance and boost damage through synergies.

Conviction Max.

I read recently that conviction maxes out at lvl 25 and does not lower res after that. If this is so then I would avoid putting more than 17-18 pts there untill you have absolutely completed your equipment allocation. 3 pts goes a long way if you need say redemtion for mana.

Weapon Choice.

I have been fortunate enough to find a perfect Heavens Light ( plus 3 skills, 2 sockets ) and I think this would be a slightly better choice for the "ultimate" none-rune word avenger weapon. Although SL is faster and has nice static mod, HL offers 3 pal pts (conviction could now be lvl 16 saving 4 skill pts) - enemy def and of course 2 sockets instead of one. It is a personal choice of course but worth considering as the static field mod is SL's best asset and of course cannot reduce monster hp to less than 50% in hell.

Other than those pts it seems the avenger build is a great pvm tool. I pushed to a4nm with a summoning necro and a bo baba on second comp and have done it easily so far. If the connection problems I am having with bnet dissipate tonight I will make a5 Hell and let you know the result. Btw my choice of armour is a Stone made in a nice low str armour. 1600 def, 15 res, clay golem charges and only 91 str req at lvl 51. As I plan to max all 3 syns of vengeance I pick up an extra 10% max F/L/C res. Not as godly as GA but double the def, 15% extra res and of course an extra friend to play with.

More comments please

:buddies: :drink: :sleep: :xx: that's life......

[Radu]

Nord's Tenderizer is a better weapon, also Death Cleaver. That is right, don't allocate more than 18 points to Conviction; also allocate one point in Redemption, it's a wonder skill; the rest of the points may go into Defiance (HS synergy) or the resist auras (Vengeance synergy).

Stone is great, but paladins lack resistances on Hell, so... if you`ve got another way (shield and charms) to keep your resists at good levels (60+ recommended), you can use it.

[Vectom]

Nord's Tenderizer is a better weapon, also Death Cleaver. That is right, don't allocate more than 18 points to Conviction; also allocate one point in Redemption, it's a wonder skill; the rest of the points may go into Defiance (HS synergy) or the resist auras (Vengeance synergy).

Stone is great, but paladins lack resistances on Hell, so... if you`ve got another way (shield and charms) to keep your resists at good levels (60+ recommended), you can use it.

What's so good on Nord's weapon? It has lower damage, it's slower and has no static (not talking about light absorb and other stats) compared to Stormlash?

Ok, it seems you agree with most of the gear but something-to-leech-mana-from and the weapon. So again, what's the best weapon for such build (and gear setup) and how much ML should I have to avoid mana problems?

Thx in advance

[wisedoor]

Avengers are really nerfed in PvP compared to what they were in 1.09 imho.
Against PKs, if you hit them with Stormlash you *may* put them running with 1 hit, or even kill, even with the new 1/6 pvp penalty, but it´s harder. I used a cruel PB of Evis and focused my equipt into other mods.
They are still good in PvM. You´ll clean hell nicely with your setup.
But... do you have all that stuff in HC? your build is pretty expensive for HC.

[sexyfool]

Just equipped HL and it kicks a$$. With gores and HL the 50% cb is really noticable. At lvl 61 I have 2 pts in vengeance (2nd pt a mistake) max res light and 3pts each in res cold and res fire. This gives 2k vengeance without factoring in the conviction bonus (lvl 23 as I am waiting to trade/find HoZ). I was using lava gouts but will switch to LoH as the demon ed is too good to miss. Nm Baal with 4 players in game dies in about 12 hits without LoH. You can really see the cb hits take effect.

Mana needs for lvl 7 vengeance at 5.5 mana per hit is easily handled by manald @ 7% ml but as I said earlier if you go the max vengeance route you will need a whole lot more.....

I cannot think of a single reason why Nords Tenderiser would be even 1/2 as good as SL let alone HL so perhaps someone else can help there. I used Nords on a mace baba for meph/pindle running and eventually switched to baranars for better killing so... you tell me.

I don't have crown of ages and I am thinking seriously about using tals mask for the dual leech and res. This would free up ring and help with the loss of life which is more serious in Baals than loss of mana unless you get BO.

I have also notice that even with crappy ar (50% to hit nm baal) I rarely miss so the "hidden" conviction bonus does really work.

Zeal on hotkey is handy for small monsters as vengeance is slower and blows em away so fast you don't get much benefit.

Anyway, I'll keep you posted as I wander through Hell busting skulls and kicking a$$. Cya.

[Vectom]

Hello sexyfool,

thx for all the info. I am pretty done with the planning and ready to kick some rotten butts :yep:

I will also let you know, how the journey continues. Cya

Vect

[Ragnarod]

Maybe this guide (http://strategy.diabloii.net/news.php?id=510) would make an interesting read for you, give it a try :)

[Vectom]

Maybe this guide (http://strategy.diabloii.net/news.php?id=510) would make an interesting read for you, give it a try :)

Hmm, isn't there a "bug" in the guide? I've put 10 points into the Light. res. aura and it rises the max. light. res. by 10%, not 5%. So, 1pt. = 1%, not 0.5%...or is something weird happening to my paly? Oo

[Ragnarod]

It rises your max light resistance by 0.5% per point when not active, 1% when active, as far as I know, so there's no bug there :o

[Radu]

Vectom: this is a PvM discussion; Nord's is excellent, it`s fast and has lots of cold damage. I played a lot with it and I know what it can.

[sexyfool]

I have taken my avenger to a4 hell now.

No serious problems although I went through about 12 golems doing the council at travincal. The only other serious monsters were vipers in the temple. A little careful work there, drawing them out of doorways did the job. Aside from those two area's however, at no time did this guy even look like having a problem.

I did "help" him out by logging on 2nd comp with baba to bo but it is possible to do without so long as you don't mind taking twice as much time to get there.

Once again Radu you suggest Nords Tenderiser. I know it is a good weapon but for this build it is not the best weapon. Compared to Heavens Light it lacks 3 Paladin skill points, 33% crushing blow and 2 sockets instead of one. My experience is not guess work, I just finished 5 hours of skull bashing with HL and it rocks hard. Three different friends were in the game at odd times and all of them were amazed at how much damage the pal could dish out and how much he could take.

At the moment he is wearing tals mask(ort), 1605 def stone armour, heavens light (sheal/eth), mosers (2 p diamond), nos coil, raven frost, rare ll res ring, LoH, gore riders and a rare plus 1 pal skill res ammy. With only 3 or 4 charms this gives 80/32/85/66 res, 2.2k def or 6.6k with hs. He has a natural 1k life and after BO/Shout (lvl 32) he has 21.k def and 2.3k life. Fairly decent equipment although not godly and I have not found/traded for a HoZ yet.

All in all I have found this guy to be the most flexible and durable tank I can ever remember playing. Party friendly and tough enough to solo Hell. I will probably wait for a friends zon to do Chaos with but that aside I think Avenger's own.

One thing I did not mention was that the bare minimum life leech even with this weapon is the 14% i have. I am going to scout around for an old rare 7% ll ring I have. It is the one thing I would really like to improve.

Anyway, gl with your own avengers and keep the suggestions/comments coming.

[Vectom]

Hello guys,

I've just traded for 300ed StormLash (man, how happy I am :winner: ) and still haven't decided if it is worth to go for 8fps attack, which would cost me another 45IAS. Since I want to have nearly max resists in hell without adding many res. sc's, I would have to get something like 3 res/ias jewels, which aren't really cheap.

The question is, whether it is worth it or not. I'd like to hear someone who has experienced both attack speeds (9fps and 8fps) and tell me how it went. With vengeance, ofc.

Thx and keep it comming :thumbsup:

[sexyfool]

Mission accomplished.

VengeanceBeMyne became a Guardian (hcl west) 2 days ago. The primary equipment is still the same as noted above and worked very well all the way through Hell. I had an inspiration and socketted an on old Hellrack I had with -req jewel and a shael for weapon switch and it works a treat. No more feeling useless in Chaos Sanctuary. It actually does more damage than Heavens light and because of its high ele damage benefits greatly from conviction.

Just to be fair to Radu I had a friend of mine with almost identical build equip Nords. He was 6 lvls higher with all 3 syns to Vengeance maxed and showed 2.4k max damage as opposed to my 1.8k. That was what the character screen showed anyway.....In the field my pal killed so much faster its a joke. With over 50% enemy def reduced (HL + eth) and 33% crushing blow Heavens Light is simply the best none rune word weapon for an avenger.

I miscalculated the life leech numbers below and have 23% not 18%. This is the most important change made from the guide stickied at the top of the page and proved to be vital. The 1 point in zeal as a pre req is great value with plus skills. I generally zeal the packs to leech and switch to vengeance if the killing is too slow or of physical immunes are present.

You can find me and my pal on hclwest evenings GMT + 8hrs (same as Korea). See you out there. :howdy:

[Radu]

Congrats for becoming a Guardian :). What I love about Nord's is its huge cold damage and the "Freeze target" mod; besides, it is fast. With it, I simply paralize the targets.