Soulesschild's PvP Bone Necro v6.0

[soulesschild]

Since all posts have all gone AWOL :(, im reposting this for discussion and debate :)

http://soulesschild.hiveports.com/necguide/


kbob, Bb, if you guys want me to host your guides as well, since i dont like how they format guides in the strat comp, ill be happy to teach you/do it for you :)

can anyone confirm that Tornado is UNBLOCKABLE?

[Mad Mantis]

Do we look like Wind Dr00ds?

No seriously, I think you can best ask the Druids that.

[Scarpachi]

I don't understand why you don't suggest to max bone armor. Maxing bone armor would help or not?

[Boxer1]

Waste of skill points maxing bone armor is...

[soulesschild]

wait i said max bone armor?!?!?!!? o.X

ah ok i see what i did wrong, worded it weird, will fix that

@scar, in 1.09 maxing bone armor was a good idea, but now with synergies theres no point because each point into bone wall/prison gives +15 damage absorbed while each point into bone armor gives +10 damage absorbed.

[Pallidum]

I don't understand why you don't suggest to max bone armor. Maxing bone armor would help or not?

The problem with that is two fold. First, bone wall and prison synergized with armor and increase magic damage, therefore it makes much more sense to max those two before armor. Secondly, in order to deal the maximum possible damage, all the synergies need to be maxed a feat that require 100 points alone. Theres simply not enough points to go around.

[Rewen]

Hey souless I'm sendin' you an e-mail about hotlinking and hosting of The encyclo.:cool:

Nice frikkin' guide btw. Teh sweet.:thumbsup:

[soulesschild]

heh thx bb, still constantly improving, check ur email again btw


oh boy im gonna have a fun time doing this guide :), this will most likely take me about a week depending on how much free time i have, look for it soon guys :)

[TheToad]

wind druids are basically the most annoying of all the things a necro can come across, since with unstacked fhr, ur hit recovery = 11 frames = their cast rate. by this i meant the engima vareity that teles on top of u and spams tornadoes that each hit twice.

i did testing, tornadoes are unblockable, and hit twice if cast at close range since they wave side to side.

due to minion stacking, ur first spear will kill off their wolves or whatever but leave the druid untouched, so he spams u with the equvalent of 5 fpa 6k damage tornadoes which are unblockable, and u die quickly.

using engima against wind druids is pointless, its better idea to run. since namlock tele causes the caster to pop out on top, run down, and shoot spear up. smart druids ill then start trying to "cut u off". use teeth.

best idea is to use 9 fpc casting (125) by 2 caster rings, , rare circ with 20%, hoto, mage, arachnid, and a 5-10 basic crafted caster amulet. optimally, u can get a 15-20 % fcr amulet but those are hard to get; my setup aloows for 9 fpc with not that much expense because usually everythings pretty cheap besides the 15-20% amulet. also, pile on enough hit recovery charms to hit the 6 frame breakpoint, forgot what this is but its on soullesschilds guide, its the one above 56%. otheriwse, ur hit recov rate will equal their cast rate, which is not very healthy. someone suggested bloodfists and using 10 frame (75) also.

"good" wind druids duel by namelocking u and using this to follow ur teleport; when u waste time to shoot backward, they catch up since they're confident that spam vs spam, they will win.

bonespirit and spear are both useless due to minion stacking.

thus, shooting teeth backwards at the following druid is the best way; however, by wasting one casting period they will catch up and u'll be hit by hurricane, and blocklocked by wolves, and be screwed. healthiest combination of strategy and skill would be to get the 6 frame fhr breakpoint ah i remeber it now, (86), cast at either 10 or 9, 9 preferably, and spam teeth in front of where u think they'd gonn next teleport. when they get on screen, that means they're next move wil be to namelock teleport u, then start spamming spears upward. with the proper fhr and cast rate, u should be able to win.

nice guide soullesschild. i think i fought u in a pubbie before.

[Sparksplit]

Why is the guide cut off by "</fon" in the middle of the weapon section? Is it just me?

[chaos9]

Why is the guide cut off by "</fon" in the middle of the weapon section? Is it just me?

No, it isn't just you. I can only view half the guide too.

[soulesschild]

No, it isn't just you. I can only view half the guide too.

weird o.O, ill see whats up with this


edit: ok seems to be fixed on my screen

[umbrella]

What do you think about maxing a curse? Decrep perhaps?

[umbrella]

Should I max decrep or any curse?

[soulesschild]

Should I max decrep or any curse?


nope, you want the most damage you could possibly get, unless of course u use marrowwalk bug, then you could potentially max a curse

[darkmog84]

ok first off souless gj..i lub ur gu1d3 :D
i have had a necro with just about the same exact setup..

in my accts of dueling the only 2 types that i have not been able to beat 95%+ of the time is trap sins..

foh pallys r very ez, place on point in skel and one in skel mage, go to cold plains and get a couple of skel, the pally will be targeting the skels instead of u...weak ez kill gg owned

wind druids..
just spam teeth and keep 125 fcr. move out of the way if u think he will teleport on top of u, they really arent that hard. also if u want spam about 3-4 spears in the begg. to kill about all of their summons, quite weak. gg owned.

trap sins...
no my problem is that i wanted to keep one setup for all types. problem is im not using tgods (arachnids) or blackhorns (3-20-30 circ).. so i was thinkin about if u had any good strats for one setup necro...
trap sins. eek :xx: find a new game ;) lolz

just to add more.
bone armor is useless to max, only adds ~200 more..pfft whateverz

dun max any curse if u dun have to..
dueling almost any class is quite ez, i almost nvr even curse anyone, unless they r hard :D

[soulesschild]

ok first off souless gj..i lub ur gu1d3 :D
i have had a necro with just about the same exact setup..

in my accts of dueling the only 2 types that i have not been able to beat 95%+ of the time is trap sins..

foh pallys r very ez, place on point in skel and one in skel mage, go to cold plains and get a couple of skel, the pally will be targeting the skels instead of u...weak ez kill gg owned

wind druids..
just spam teeth and keep 125 fcr. move out of the way if u think he will teleport on top of u, they really arent that hard. also if u want spam about 3-4 spears in the begg. to kill about all of their summons, quite weak. gg owned.

trap sins...
no my problem is that i wanted to keep one setup for all types. problem is im not using tgods (arachnids) or blackhorns (3-20-30 circ).. so i was thinkin about if u had any good strats for one setup necro...
trap sins. eek :xx: find a new game ;) lolz

just to add more.
bone armor is useless to max, only adds ~200 more..pfft whateverz

dun max any curse if u dun have to..
dueling almost any class is quite ez, i almost nvr even curse anyone, unless they r hard :D

the most important thing agaisnt trappers is FHR, if not using tgods or GA, then you need to hit 53 or above FHR, else you can very easily get yourself screwed

[piroteuss]

Wind druids are pretty ok if u use 2 raven frosts + bone armor with BO( tornado + hurricane do both physical and cold dmg)
Get 4300+ bonespear dmg and enough fhr, they should be dead before u drop.
Oh and u will need good aiming skills to hit the druid instead of the dogs/spirit.

Spam BS by clicking on the ground below u, when druid teleports on u, immediately hover the cursor to the druid's name and hold it there, the past few bs that u have spammed prior to this will make a U-turn and go for the druid, change to bonespear immediately once you have the namelock and fireaway.

This works well for me.

[piroteuss]

Good trapsins and blizzard sorcs are the hardest to duel....

[soulesschild]

a good wind druid will destroy you if you try that strategy, if u use bonespear theres that bug with his minions

[ThyForbidden]

I'd like to lend my wisdom as an avid PVP necro player.
My current necro is level 73. Why 73? We'll, I like to remain a sort of low level, 73 is the level I need for items so far.
First I put 10 points in teeth, then saved up with 1 in golem and one in golem mastery(saved points so i can put 1 level in bone spear synergies when they were availible, this way i maxed spear at lvl 38). With 1 in golem, onein golem mast it takes level 90 to finish, I'm 73 and am staying that way for a long time(because I feel like it). I raised my str to 40, reason for this is its MUCH easier to raise str/mana with charms and items than life! I have 890 base life.
First skill i maxed was spear, then bone prison, then bone wall. I was leveling wall and spear at the same time for a while. My teeth are nearly maxed, spirit level 1.

Why spear and not spirit is this: Spirit is slow, spirit doesn't kill smart people, alot of people have enigma.
People like to think you can prison people and spirit them. NO, you can't, they destroy the prison and get away befor they hit because spirits are so, so unless your closer than 1/4th a screen away(which you shouldn't be), then they will escape your spirits even when prisoned.
Spear is much faster, better at long range, and it appears to have a bigger hit range than spirit. With spirit it seems the sides of it can go through people, while with spear it seems it's acually 150% as wide as the acual back part of the wave!, i've done testing with this. Spear is pretty much a fireball that no one is immune to!

Strategies:
For melee use name click, hold onto them and prison then spear, keep hitting hotkeys to switch between so they dont break out.
For FOH paladins encase yourself in bone walls, do this because they rarely acually click on you but near you. They will very very often hit your bone walls while you kill them. Or you can run away and snipe them if your map aim is good(what i normally do), or run to them quickly and prison them, you'll get hit once but use your FCR to keep him stun and kill him befor his cast delay is over.
For trappassins cast bone walls off to the side of yourself, the traps will shoot these while you get up to the assassin and bone spear her, then her traps disipear. Alot of times I end up dying with the assassin because traps dont go away right away. You can also map aim to snipe them.
For Hammerdins. you shouldn't lose.. unless they have enigma and good hit recov.
For sorces, any type. Lose and you suck.. I mean really.. you should have 75%-85% resist and high life, most sorc can't take much damage, there e-sheild drains their mana so they can't escape or fight back
Kickassin, WW assassin.. you have bone armor and high life, just name hit them.

You need faster cast rate, 1 spear hits and they will get stunned because f your FCR rate. Most peopel can't tele away. I kill level 80 necs with enigma and bone spirit often with my nec by just waiting for them to tele to close while running from spirits, 1 of my spear hits and they can't tele, more hit and they die. Most people with enigma don't seem to have very high life.
I have a problem beating people using scrollhack though.. but thats because they cheat... FOH dins with enigma i can rarely ever beat, but thats cause they are lame. :)
Enigma elemental druids i win/lose half the time.. I consider bone armor not absorbing the tornados to be a bug though( its phys damage!), I should always win ;)

[piroteuss]

souless : what bug is that? I have no problems as of now...care to enlighten me about it ?

[darkmog84]

souless : what bug is that? I have no problems as of now...care to enlighten me about it ?
i believe if him and his minions r "stacked" spear doesnt hit him..
just spam like 3 teeth, killing all his minions then spear.. gg owned

Good trapsins and blizzard sorcs are the hardest to duel....
eh? i agree with the trapsin but bliz sorcs? they r so weak unless they town guard...just get some teleport/spear control that must be ur biggest problem..

if u can teleport the properly place i think 2-3 spears they r out, every time

[synkroniz]

Harlow fellows,

what should i socket in 1.08 valk helm ?
which char is valk helm best against ?
is trang belt good to use in pvp?

kkthx

[soulesschild]

1.08 valk helm...hrm either resist jewel or something else thats useful, valk helm is like an overall helm or when you need to hit the 125% faster cast breakpoint or you need it for FHR

trang belt is decent in pvp, but CBF isnt too important if your using enigma

[SadisticRodent]

I use spear and spirit. Both are good in some situations. Though I hate to admit spear is looking to be better. One question though, how high do ur skills/synergies need to be for spear to exceed spirits damage if both of them are maxed??

Oh and a little example of why u dont need to max armor: mine absorbs 810 damage from +skills gear and maxed synergies alone :)

[soulesschild]

I use spear and spirit. Both are good in some situations. Though I hate to admit spear is looking to be better. One question though, how high do ur skills/synergies need to be for spear to exceed spirits damage if both of them are maxed??

Oh and a little example of why u dont need to max armor: mine absorbs 810 damage from +skills gear and maxed synergies alone :)

around the forties

[iamapoorman]

around the forties

I am building a bone necro this weekend and have just completed collecting all the pieces of the Trang's Set. After reading the guide I was a little bit frustrated that the entire Trang's Set isn't a viable option for a PvP bone necro. Is this really the case, even with the added bonuses you get from wearing the whole set (and also looking like a vampire?)

If I want to keep the set and still make a good necro, what kind of build should I make then? Any advice will be appreciated.

[Mad Mantis]

Either a Skelliemancer or a Venomancer. You could try a Meleemancer, but there are way better options for a Meleemancer than Trang's.

[soulesschild]

trangs set has a horrid cast animation when ur in a vampire form, so unfortuantely to say, its not a viable option

[-=(Virus)=-]

Hey souless i was makeing a PVP necro going all vita and i aint gona use igma.
I got 2 4 socket monarchs but is it vise to use em, as en the 156 strngh is too high?
What u think sohuld i use em or find a 3 socket sheild?

[FattyMcGee]

Hey souless i was makeing a PVP necro going all vita and i aint gona use igma.
I got 2 4 socket monarchs but is it vise to use em, as en the 156 strngh is too high?
What u think sohuld i use em or find a 3 socket sheild?

personally, I think using a 3 socket kite shield is totally worth saving those tons of skill points and putting them into vit. Vit will help you in ALL duels, all situations... and 156 str is a helluva lot to give up when you're going an all vit build.

the difference between a 3 socket kite shield and 4 socket monarch is only 40% of the single element resist... you can make that up in less than 4 res scs (they go up to 11% single element res each). Easily worth the extra life.

--fatty

[soulesschild]

personally, I think using a 3 socket kite shield is totally worth saving those tons of skill points and putting them into vit. Vit will help you in ALL duels, all situations... and 156 str is a helluva lot to give up when you're going an all vit build.

the difference between a 3 socket kite shield and 4 socket monarch is only 40% of the single element resist... you can make that up in less than 4 res scs (they go up to 11% single element res each). Easily worth the extra life.

--fatty

took the words right out of my mouth fatty :D

[umbrella]

I think I'm going to try maxing Decrepify or Iron maiden, which one do you think is better?
Oh and trapsins aren't that hard to beat..
Tgods+Blackhorns = gg

[-=(Virus)=-]

Where do i buy 3 socket Kite Shields/Shields?

*Edit* N/M Charisa in hell sells :)
Also i got 2 3socket sigon type sheild, should i use them or get 2 kite sheilds and whats the difference?

[soulesschild]

Where do i buy 3 socket Kite Shields/Shields?

*Edit* N/M Charisa in hell sells :)
Also i got 2 3socket sigon type sheild, should i use them or get 2 kite sheilds and whats the difference?

if ur using teleport it makes no difference, if your running, it slows you down a bit

[Royal_Paladin14]

if ur using teleport it makes no difference, if your running, it slows you down a bit

what's a good place to find bone gcs.

[soulesschild]

what's a good place to find bone gcs.

there really is no best place to find them, i cubed mine using 3 pgems + gc from cows

[Royal_Paladin14]

there really is no best place to find them, i cubed mine using 3 pgems + gc from cows

hmm gcs from baal can get some insane mods when cubed.

[-=(Virus)=-]

Hey for PVP should i use OAK or Perfect shade, oak has good **** on it but shade has 4 to spsiirt and 5 to spear?

[FattyMcGee]

Hey for PVP should i use OAK or Perfect shade, oak has good **** on it but shade has 4 to spsiirt and 5 to spear?

it really depends on the rest of your equipment...

oak has much better non+skill mods, so if you are hurting in resists, or need that extra faster cast rate to get to the next breakpoint, oak is worth it. If you don't need what oak gives you, because you can make it up with other items easily, then use your boneshade, becaues it'll give you more damage.

--fatty

[-=(Virus)=-]

Well the sad story is this. I got, this
Boneshade 25%Fastcastrate
Magefist 20%
Archnidmid Mesh 20%
Perfect Upgraded Viper 30%
19% Ammy w/ 2 to psn bone
10% Ring
Total = 124 (short of 1% :O)
Now if i get oak thats, 40% which is 15 % more i can take of the ****ty ring.
So what you guys suggest?

[soulesschild]

Well the sad story is this. I got, this
Boneshade 25%Fastcastrate
Magefist 20%
Archnidmid Mesh 20%
Perfect Upgraded Viper 30%
19% Ammy w/ 2 to psn bone
10% Ring
Total = 124 (short of 1% :O)
Now if i get oak thats, 40% which is 15 % more i can take of the ****ty ring.
So what you guys suggest?


I WANT YOUR AMULET!!!!!!!!! whatsh the lvl req on it btw, ive been tryin to craft something like that for ages

you can always use lidless/darkforce spawn :)

[-=(Virus)=-]

Yeah but the feeling of having 125% fcr is awsome without switching :)
Oh its
Lvl 55 req
2Psn bone
5% Mana regen
4 to dex
11 to mana
50 posion over 3 sec
^-^
i'm on HCL USWEST

[-=(Virus)=-]

Also if u had my ammy how would u change your setup? would u have 75% ot 125%?

I wish it was 20% :(

[-=(Virus)=-]

Hey guys i just relised my strngh is 156 with all my items, u guys think i should now use 4 socket monarchs with topaz and p saf? i think i should as they got more denfense and4 sockets compared to my 3 :(
Please reply

[soulesschild]

Hey guys i just relised my strngh is 156 with all my items, u guys think i should now use 4 socket monarchs with topaz and p saf? i think i should as they got more denfense and4 sockets compared to my 3 :(
Please reply

lucky bastard :) yea i use 4 socket shields, frees up more gear

if i had ur amulet, id go for 125% faster cast

[-=(Virus)=-]

sweet with oak,archmid,viper,magefist ammy i get 125 :)
Now before in a duel i had
Tgods,85 res all with 160 res sheild, i was too scared to duel a trapsin you guys think i would of owned her?
We were playing in normal.
I'm gona get blackthrons for 20 absorb.

[soulesschild]

get a wisp projector if you can, get 95 all res stacked and you'll be fine on a trapper...i think...


sorry i havent really updated guide in awhile, i do plan to add a MF section sooner or later, been working on my summoner and HTMLing beatboxers thing, though i havent had much time for that either unfortuately, SAT's, friends, family, whole bunch of junk coming up ><'

[-=(Virus)=-]

****, i was playing HCL, some lvl 56 Druid wanted to duel me so i said lets go (thinking it was a walk in the park i went outside and waited for him).
So im' in bloodmore waiting.
I look around dont see him so i proceede to type something, as i'm in the middle of typeing he comes up to me and hits me twice and i'm dead, i was like WTF :(. Lucky my mate looted me, but i lost ss,tgods,2 4socet monarchs, perfect tiara, 8 Psn bone charms :'(~~

This sucks

[FattyMcGee]

****, i was playing HCL, some lvl 56 Druid wanted to duel me so i said lets go (thinking it was a walk in the park i went outside and waited for him).
So im' in bloodmore waiting.
I look around dont see him so i proceede to type something, as i'm in the middle of typeing he comes up to me and hits me twice and i'm dead, i was like WTF :(. Lucky my mate looted me, but i lost ss,tgods,2 4socet monarchs, perfect tiara, 8 Psn bone charms :'(~~

This sucks


O.O holy **** man. even when your buddy looted you, he still couldn't get all that stuff? oh man... I'm so sorry. Well, I guess you'll never type msgs when duelling again huh lol.

it's ok though, this game is always about building and rebuilding and perfecting. Even though that's a big setback, maybe you can make something positive out of it... maybe twink your necro even better than before!

I'm just glad I don't play hc... I think I'd get to angry at the world. I get mad enough when ppl steal my gold hehe.

--fatty

[-=(Virus)=-]

Yeah this sucks bad.
I mean looseing the necro was like NOO a lot of anger and then when i lost my sorc i didnt feel anything, just felt like i never lost anything and was thinking of quiting until next season. BUT i'l just make another sorc get items and remake necro sigh. :(

[davidoff]

Block seems to be very important for pvp right ?

i tried the vitamancer, it's nice, but i get hit always when they charge me ..
So i die fast even though i have a bone armor worth 1350 dmg absorb .

[soulesschild]

Block seems to be very important for pvp right ?

i tried the vitamancer, it's nice, but i get hit always when they charge me ..
So i die fast even though i have a bone armor worth 1350 dmg absorb .

if your dueling public and ur using enigma, u shouldnt be gettin hit, now if ur in league, its a different story

[FattyMcGee]

if your dueling public and ur using enigma, u shouldnt be gettin hit, now if ur in league, its a different story


it depends on your tele and the tele speed of your opponent. The only real problems with a vitamancer in pubby pvp I can see are:

1. telebarbs w/ a lot of fast cast (few and far between, but they're there)
2. ww sins with df

the ww sins I've duelled can be tough at times, tho most aren't too bad at all. For the best however, I've been real glad I've had my 75% block.

Then again, against unblockable dmg chars (most) I really wish I had more life lol. Overall tho, I'm glad I built a block necro. I think they're a bit more versatile, at least for me, using the strategies I play.

--fatty

[soulesschild]

it depends on your tele and the tele speed of your opponent. The only real problems with a vitamancer in pubby pvp I can see are:

1. telebarbs w/ a lot of fast cast (few and far between, but they're there)
2. ww sins with df

the ww sins I've duelled can be tough at times, tho most aren't too bad at all. For the best however, I've been real glad I've had my 75% block.

Then again, against unblockable dmg chars (most) I really wish I had more life lol. Overall tho, I'm glad I built a block necro. I think they're a bit more versatile, at least for me, using the strategies I play.

--fatty

fear my summoner :D ;)

[xAnjelofLytex]

Since all posts have all gone AWOL :(, im reposting this for discussion and debate :)

http://soulesschild.hiveports.com/necguide/


kbob, Bb, if you guys want me to host your guides as well, since i dont like how they format guides in the strat comp, ill be happy to teach you/do it for you :)

can anyone confirm that Tornado is UNBLOCKABLE?


My barb has never been able to block a tornado, fireball, bone spirit, etc. Thats why I always go 2h at those casters. Might as well try and kill in one WW.

[mrJ]

My barb has never been able to block a tornado, fireball, bone spirit, etc. Thats why I always go 2h at those casters. Might as well try and kill in one WW.It's taken as a given that things like Fireball and bs are unblockable, (Unless of course you're a dual claw wb'ing sin), but there's been some conflicting opinion as of late, I think, as to whether Tornado specifically was blockable.

[FattyMcGee]

Ok souless, I have some disappointing news

I already knew that bone spirit doesn't hit teleing wind druids due to the minion stacking bug. But... fenris and I just tested and while his minions were still directly on him... like, before they had moved off at ALL, spear AND teeth both don't hit either!

The druid makes the "ah" sound like he got hit, but his life doesn't go down, only his minion's life does. So if a fast-casting druid would be smart about his teleing, then basically, they're immune :( :( :(


just wanted to tell ppl if they didn't already know. I mean, I already knew taht spirit didn't work, but neither does spear/teeth if they have enough fast cast, and I never knew that before.


gd druids >.<

--fatty

[soulesschild]

Ok souless, I have some disappointing news

I already knew that bone spirit doesn't hit teleing wind druids due to the minion stacking bug. But... fenris and I just tested and while his minions were still directly on him... like, before they had moved off at ALL, spear AND teeth both don't hit either!

The druid makes the "ah" sound like he got hit, but his life doesn't go down, only his minion's life does. So if a fast-casting druid would be smart about his teleing, then basically, they're immune :( :( :(


just wanted to tell ppl if they didn't already know. I mean, I already knew taht spirit didn't work, but neither does spear/teeth if they have enough fast cast, and I never knew that before.


gd druids >.<

--fatty

hrm, i thought itd work that way anyhow, i mean ive done it countless times on you with my summoner, i wouldnt take damage, instead, you'd kill maybe 5-6 skeles and id still look like i was being hit but i wouldnt, must update guide again when i get home

[vandal_marauder]

Ok souless, I have some disappointing news

I already knew that bone spirit doesn't hit teleing wind druids due to the minion stacking bug. But... fenris and I just tested and while his minions were still directly on him... like, before they had moved off at ALL, spear AND teeth both don't hit either!

The druid makes the "ah" sound like he got hit, but his life doesn't go down, only his minion's life does. So if a fast-casting druid would be smart about his teleing, then basically, they're immune :( :( :(


just wanted to tell ppl if they didn't already know. I mean, I already knew taht spirit didn't work, but neither does spear/teeth if they have enough fast cast, and I never knew that before.


gd druids >.<

--fatty

it's hard but i woudlnt' say it's impossible. it's not impossible just cuz you haven't found a way. good use of pre spamming bone spirit ( tele into bone spirit hopefully ibs fields can help) and stun them with teeth or spear and when many spirits hit them at once they'll die. but if the druid's plays too defensively and keep recasting summons it will really be hard.

[FattyMcGee]

it's hard but i woudlnt' say it's impossible. it's not impossible just cuz you haven't found a way. good use of pre spamming bone spirit ( tele into bone spirit hopefully ibs fields can help) and stun them with teeth or spear and when many spirits hit them at once they'll die. but if the druid's plays too defensively and keep recasting summons it will really be hard.


I never said it was impossible to kill a druid, I'm saying it's impossible to hurt them with your bone spells when their minions are on top of them. And no, I can't get around that... it's a bug but a fact of the game.

Yes, you can get a druid if he screws up a time or 2. But the best wind druids rarely screw up, and that puts you at a great disadvantage.

BTW, even if you lay bspirit fields or teeth fields and a druid teleports into it, he will teleport out without any harm done to him as long as he continues teleing and doesn't stop to start running around. So ibs fields will help only if the druid makes a mistake, or is not experienced.

It's a lot easier to get druids with wolf summons instead of a bear, because the bear has so much life that it's just really hard to kill it with teeth, and ibs hardly ever hits it. with wolves, you can kill em with teeth pretty easily, and the druid will have to spend more time recasting, which will give you more opportunities to pounce on him.

--fatty

[Koreforce]

I really don't understand why you say "max bone prison".....with the marrowwalk bug, you can do a whole lot more damage than if you maxed it, and you'll free up 20 skill points......what's wrong with that? and It may not be a bug, however.....blizzard may have intended that if you have no points in a skill, a charge will set that synergy to level 33....if you have proof it's a bug, and I'm wrong....please tell me.

[soulesschild]

please note that it is CLAN-HONOR oriented, so using marrowalks is not an option for us CH duelers, if you dont duel under CH, then feel free to use marrowalks

[Diminished-Soul]

I am not in CH at all... But I have always hate any type of things like with "marrowwalks" as of now. Bug or not. NT IMO. I have always enjoyed "non-bm dueling" so to speak.

Btw nice guide man, I have made my necro then I forgot about the forums cuz I haven't been on here in like 2 weeks.

I did pretty much same stuff you did/use/suggest.

I did myself and went the blocking route though...

However, on a new Nec I might make will prolly be a Vitamancer.

[Mr.Popo]

actually, fireball sorc combine with hydra is the hardest sorc( with good life, max block, good fcr) Cuz even though u put rising sun and having 75 resis, since the abosrb goes after the dmg was calculate, u will not immune to their fireball or meteor and still die. U need to max 75 resis or above, wearing rising sun, dwarf starx2 in order to be immune.

[FattyMcGee]

actually, fireball sorc combine with hydra is the hardest sorc( with good life, max block, good fcr) Cuz even though u put rising sun and having 75 resis, since the abosrb goes after the dmg was calculate, u will not immune to their fireball or meteor and still die. U need to max 75 resis or above, wearing rising sun, dwarf starx2 in order to be immune.


just pop on some infernostrides and you should be fine

I haven't met a fire sorc yet that does any significant fire damage to me, even the 20k fireball sorcs

--fatty


EDIT: I meant infernostrides, while wearing rising sun and 2x dwarfstars. those 3 items will render you immune to any of their fire attacks. Of course, CH rules prohibit the absorbing I'm pretty sure... but I was thinking pubbies/non clan dueling

[soulesschild]

just pop on some infernostrides and you should be fine

I haven't met a fire sorc yet that does any significant fire damage to me, even the 20k fireball sorcs

--fatty


EDIT: I meant infernostrides, while wearing rising sun and 2x dwarfstars. those 3 items will render you immune to any of their fire attacks. Of course, CH rules prohibit the absorbing I'm pretty sure... but I was thinking pubbies/non clan dueling

technically, nokozon + hotspurs/infernostrides and your pretty much taking only 100-200 dmg max, throw on dwarf stars and its gg lol

[Corpseus]

Hey fella, nice guide. Two quick suggestions.

One, rabies actually does not just take you down to one life to my knowledge, it can kill you straight out, unlike regular poison. If you are "rabie'd" for damage that excedes your life total you will die without needing a finishing off hit. Essentially it changes little in the duel as far as your suggested strategy, however stressing the need to play agrressive once hit is pretty important. I haven't tested it exclusively but from my obsevations I believe it is correct.

Two, vs poison necs, since you said you have had little experience vs them, if they are tweaked out you should stack poison resist(to counter lower resist) + max poison resist(if your build allows it) + poison length reduction. Death's hand are a good piece of equip for doing this.

Hope the info helps. Once again nice guide.

[soulesschild]

Hey fella, nice guide. Two quick suggestions.

One, rabies actually does not just take you down to one life to my knowledge, it can kill you straight out, unlike regular poison. If you are "rabie'd" for damage that excedes your life total you will die without needing a finishing off hit. Essentially it changes little in the duel as far as your suggested strategy, however stressing the need to play agrressive once hit is pretty important. I haven't tested it exclusively but from my obsevations I believe it is correct.

Two, vs poison necs, since you said you have had little experience vs them, if they are tweaked out you should stack poison resist(to counter lower resist) + max poison resist(if your build allows it) + poison length reduction. Death's hand are a good piece of equip for doing this.

Hope the info helps. Once again nice guide.

hrm never knew that about rabies o.O always thought the poison vine stabbed me or something o.O thanks again corpseus, ill add that info in

[FattyMcGee]

technically, nokozon + hotspurs/infernostrides and your pretty much taking only 100-200 dmg max, throw on dwarf stars and its gg lol

true :D although with that setup, you are only getting % absorb and not # absorb, so you will still take (small) damage, while with inferno + 2x d star + rising sun it can heal you!

oh, and yes Corpseus is completely right about rabies, the poison damage can actually kill you. To doublecheck feel free to look at electricblue's hybrid wolf guide.

-fatty

[Phyrexial]

A minor note about rabies for those that didn't know. It infects minions and this includes bonewalls/prisons which both can then infect you.

I've seen some very smart Rabies Druids that infected a tele necro's golem and the second the necro teleported the golem appeared on top of the necro and thus infected him. Made quick work of the necro and left him yelling "OMG WTF!" for quite a bit. :lol:

Also, I saw a non-tele necro spamming bonewall on the same druid. The necro got careless and spammed enough prison that the prison extended to where the necro was standing. Needless to say, he became infected since the Druid used Rabies on on the prison. :lol:

Just some little notes about dueling those crafty wolves.

[nataku00]

I didn't read through the whole thread to see if anyone answered your question, but I think a druid's Tornado can only be blocked with an Assassin's Weapon block passive skill. Haven't tested it out myself, but I keep hearing this in WW assassin build discussions.

[FattyMcGee]

I didn't read through the whole thread to see if anyone answered your question, but I think a druid's Tornado can only be blocked with an Assassin's Weapon block passive skill. Haven't tested it out myself, but I keep hearing this in WW assassin build discussions.

yes you're correct.

it can also be dodged by zon's avoid skill

--fatty

[Joe_smith]

I never said it was impossible to kill a druid, I'm saying it's impossible to hurt them with your bone spells when their minions are on top of them. And no, I can't get around that... it's a bug but a fact of the game.

Yes, you can get a druid if he screws up a time or 2. But the best wind druids rarely screw up, and that puts you at a great disadvantage.

BTW, even if you lay bspirit fields or teeth fields and a druid teleports into it, he will teleport out without any harm done to him as long as he continues teleing and doesn't stop to start running around. So ibs fields will help only if the druid makes a mistake, or is not experienced.

It's a lot easier to get druids with wolf summons instead of a bear, because the bear has so much life that it's just really hard to kill it with teeth, and ibs hardly ever hits it. with wolves, you can kill em with teeth pretty easily, and the druid will have to spend more time recasting, which will give you more opportunities to pounce on him.

--fatty

actually spear can still hit druids from even way off screen when he has tons of minions on top of him. also teeth wipes minions out quite fast and i think they can hit a minion on top druid sometimes too although i'm not too sure. Even spirit can hit if you name lock i think. i dueled a couple of necs whose bs bypassed my wolves oak and even merc and hit me every time. ( probalby auto aim) But decent necs with 9 fps should beat any druid more than half the time with good ping. it's quite hard compared to almost all other match ups for the bone nec. if the necro makes mistakes against a good druid or lags he's probably screwed. i'm not talking about a nec that teles away non stop cause if the druid doesn't follow you u won't kill him either. a good way is to be always on the move but find every chance to kill the druid such as when you 1 hit ko all their summons or when they are recasting bo, summons, hurricane,etc. you can tele next to them and spear them to death. yes spear can bypass summons and espeically a druid like fenris's. It takes skills or hax to win this duel for the necro, but if they have it there is not much a druid can do other than pray that the necro lags or makes a mistake. however, i'm unsure how a duel would turn out between a 9 fps necro and a 10 fps druid since you'll have to sacrifice a lot to get 163% fcr for 10 fps on a druid. additionally no decent necro with decent equipment should have to use more than 75% res and any absorb against non ene shield sorcs. 1 absorb items or 5-10% + max res is imo the most you should need otherwise you are playing very poorly or need to get a better connection or gear or build.

[ELNINO]

Which skills to you think I should max first, because this guide requires ALOT of skill points, and I prob. wont get this guy past 85.

[soulesschild]

i listed an order, teeth, spear, spirit, bone wall, prison

[fusiongt]

Hey souless what level is your bone spear? Reason I'm asking is because I have lots of problems with chargedins and hammerdins w/ enigma.

The second hammerdins warp near me I get away, try to snipe, and sometimes am successful. Othertimes I'm low on mana and have 4-5 good spears left so I just wait for him to come. He comes, I hit him with 2 spears then he lands a hammer luckily. But I don't understand how he takes 2 spears because I am lvl 91 character, all synergies maxed, and I'm using a lvl 49 spear! Maybe it was just the pally I guess but this one pally the other day was just owning my *** lol

And don't get me started with the chargdins.. I don't know what kinda weapon he was using but 1 hit would kill me. Do you have any tips to avoid that lag that occurs when they charge? I mean even if I know it's going to happen, I try warping as far as possible and in less then a second they're next to me and I'm dead. The game I was in might have been laggy or something but how could you counter this lag effect? (And I know killing him before he could charge would be great, but hitting his lagged body is difficult when you can't see it lol)

[soulesschild]

usually 41/42

[smokey[dead]]

Try using a wizardspike, more fcr is always good. In my opinion a hel'd wizardspike is better than a hoto. Have it on switch either way.

[Death on Dark Wings]

By the way, I'm not sure if you guys came by this before, but upon the infinitesimal seconds of my survival within the whirlwind of a druid and under tornadoes, I realized that a LOCKED spear damages his minions ONLY whereas a randomly fired spear hits him. Is this true? I'm not sure personally. Is there any discussion on this?

[soulesschild]

Guide has been updated to 11.0, wow this thread was originally for 6.0, came a long way havent we? ^^ Let me know if you guys find any errors or would like me to add anything.